Can a Soldier be forced to attend a promotion board?

[delta14]

I don't understand the Army or it's leaders at rimes. Can you be forced to go to a promotion board, while you're trying to reenlist and reclassify, especially if you're not ready to go?

[jay_ellis04]

Absolutely...it's called "following orders". Sorry but that's the way of the military. As long as the order is not "illegal or immoral", guess what...it's your duty to follow that order to the letter.

[Biglew97]

I just want to pile on with Jay here

But yea, if you don't want to go to the board, get out of the Army and go for an interview in the private sector, nearly the same thing.

The board is a wonderful experience, priceless almost, and those sitting on the board know you don't know everything, the whole Idea is to review you as a soldier, you should know Basic Soldiering 101 for your particular MOS, That experience gets you a leg up on others that want to be promoted, or aspire to do great things in the Army.

and You were told to, so quit whining and do it, and let yourself shine, those that are sitting on the board were in your position once and you have nothing to worry about. It is there responsiblity to develop you as a future Leader and NCO....a leader, mentor, and role model of Soldiers...

Move out smartly and Drive on

[Mike Bailey]

yes failing to be in the proper place at the time ordered is considered AWOL, and that is the last thing you need, if they do board you and you get promoted and in the meantime you have reenlisted for a new MOS as part of your reenlistment contract then you will go at the new rank, so what is the problem?

I didn't think I was ready for my first promotion board, but being 11B all you had to do was be breathing and have a pulse back in the early 70s to get promoted if I remember right the cutoff scores were 450 not exactly rocket science there required, the board for Staff Sergeant was the same now for E7 it was all done by records and I was shocked to be selected out of the secondary zone on the same promotion board as my older brother who had been in the Army 2 years longer than I, and no I don't ever let him forget it.

Use it as a learning experience and do the best you can, it will be part of your permanent record.

[delta14]

The problem is I don't need to be in a position of authority going into a brand new MOS not fully knowing how to do the job or having any experience in the field. I don't have a problem getting promoted, but if I become promotable I will lose my school seat and can't reclass. And that's to me is called screwing a soldier over. And the fact that they're only giving me less than two weeks to prepare is also a huge problem. Another problem is that no one in my change of command recommended me to go. I'm not prepared at all, so what's the big hurry?

It's situations like this that make soldiers not want to stay in the military at all.

[Biglew97]

I don't have a problem getting promoted, but if I become promotable I will lose my school seat and can't reclass. And that's to me is called screwing a soldier over.


This is an understandable issue and I would be aggravated. You should have said that when you started this thread.

The best thing you can do is engage your Squad Leader, and your immediate chain of command, and explain why you shouldn't go to the Board. Make it abundantly clear that you are wanting to reclass, and as a term of your re-enlistment (I'm assuming (and I hate assuming) you are using this as an option for re-enlistment) any promoteable status will eliminate your desire to re-enlist and also decreases your re-enlistment options.

You can also engage you Co. and Bn. retention NCO's and explain to them the situation, so that they may intervene on your behalf. Believe me they don't want to lose a hard charger because of some damn board, and besides it is their Job to try and fulfill your wishes on your re-enlistment...

And if all else fails, I'm sure you still have the "Open Door Policies." Request an audience with your CO, or the Bn. CO, and explain your situation. You will have to use the chain of command or you could get in some hot water, and don't re-enlist unless you get what it is that you want, don't settle just because you think you have to.

[jay_ellis04]

Understandably, yes, I can understand the frustration at having to attend a board under these circumstances. I am confused about one small thing though that I would (just for the sake of my own ease), like to have answered. If no one from your chain of command has recommended you to go to the board, who is MAKING you go? If you aren't recommended, then HOW can you go? Who is behind this? Just curious as that particular facet is a little confusing.

[delta14]

Understandably, yes, I can understand the frustration at having to attend a board under these circumstances. I am confused about one small thing though that I would (just for the sake of my own ease), like to have answered. If no one from your chain of command has recommended you to go to the board, who is MAKING you go? If you aren't recommended, then HOW can you go? Who is behind this? Just curious as that particular facet is a little confusing.

We've yet to figure out how my name got on the list. I believe because I'm assigned to one unit and and attached to another, the unit I'm assigned to put my name on the promotion roster. But it has all been settled and I;m not going, yet :D

[Sal]

AR-600-8-19 para. 5–11. Declination of selection board consideration.
a. A Soldier who is within the zone of consideration for promotion may decline such consideration before his or her
promotion packet is assembled and sent to the promotion board. Once the packet has been sent to the board, the Soldier
cannot decline consideration. However, if selected and placed on the PPRL, the Soldier may request removal from the
list per paragraph 5–27c.
b. A declination of board consideration will be a written statement signed by the Soldier, witnessed by an NCO or
officer, and inserted in the Soldier’s MPF. The declination will remain in effect for any subsequent boards unless the
Soldier changes his or her mind and requests board consideration. In this event, the declination will be removed from
the MPF, annotated by the custodian to indicate the declination was withdrawn on a specified date, retained by the
custodian until the next regular board is convened, and then destroyed.
c. When a Soldier declines promotion consideration, it is essential that the Soldier’s immediate supervisor and the
CDR determine the reason for the declination and provide adequate counseling.

[FieldArtillery07]

Just because they send you to the board doesn't mean you have to be an e4p. You could always go there forgetting everything. "i dont recall at this time sir." If they dont think you are ready they wont give you promotable status. Just a suggestion.

[lilreeves]

Hey Delat14 I'm going through the samething,I'm being forced to go to the promotion board and I ETS in Jan go figure!!! I was told that once I get promoted I would change my mind about the Army,I have yet to study or make a attempt to study to me this shows that I have a lack of motivation making me unfit to lead others but I guess I'm the only one who see it that way.If the Army is hurting for NCO'S that bad then maybe they should do more to keep soldiers in ranks instead of forcing soldiers who are not ready or willing to attend a promotion board.

[SSgtAllen3381]

I don't understand the Army or it's leaders at rimes. Can you be forced to go to a promotion board, while you're trying to reenlist and reclassify, especially if you're not ready to go?

I wish that was a process we Marines had to do. I guarantee there wouldn't be as many people at their present rank.

[brak]

I think this is one of the major problems the Army is having right now. When a Soldier enters the secondary zone, the first thing people seem to be concerned with is "Has he been to the board?" That shouldn't be the first question. A more appropriate question is "Is he ready for the board?"

The promotion board is not the time to learn to be an NCO. Soldiers should be ready to lead Soldiers and pin on hard stripes before they knock on that door.

Soldiers can be NCOs in 18 months now. Maybe I'm old school, but that's really fast to me.

[NAM6768]

I just want to pile on with Jay here

But yea, if you don't want to go to the board, get out of the Army and go for an interview in the private sector, nearly the same thing.

The board is a wonderful experience, priceless almost, and those sitting on the board know you don't know everything, the whole Idea is to review you as a soldier, you should know Basic Soldiering 101 for your particular MOS, That experience gets you a leg up on others that want to be promoted, or aspire to do great things in the Army.

and You were told to, so quit whining and do it, and let yourself shine, those that are sitting on the board were in your position once and you have nothing to worry about. It is there responsiblity to develop you as a future Leader and NCO....a leader, mentor, and role model of Soldiers...

Move out smartly and Drive on

I think his situation is that he wants to reclassify into another MOS and if he goes to a promotion board and is promoted in his current MOS, he will be stuck for the time prescribed by regulations. I've been retired now for 27 years, I was a Senior Personnel Sergeant. I ran into this a few times. As for being 'FORCED', I don't think anyone can be forced to do anything, however, they will suffer the consequences. Back in the early 60's we had a lot of soldiers that retired as E-3's. When asked why they didn't want a promotion, they would say something like "I want to drive my truck, I don't want to be the motor Sergeant". Those were professional soldiers that were professionals in their grade and MOS. However, the Army changed over the years and things changed. I remember Cooks and MP's having a difficult time making it to E-6 and many retired as E-5's, or SFC E-6's. Yes, SFC E-6, we also had MSG E-7 back then too. My have things changed over the years. I say inform your Commander of your intentions so he can select the next best person to go to the board in your place. Truck on and do Re-Up.

[JStatus330]

LOL today my supervisor said I'm going to the Soldier of the month board next month. I said no I'm not, I don't wanna do that. He jokes and stuff but I hope he's not serious cause I'm not doing all that stuff. There are other people in the office that he can choose.

[Michaep]

LOL today my supervisor said I'm going to the Soldier of the month board next month. I said no I'm not, I don't wanna do that. He jokes and stuff but I hope he's not serious cause I'm not doing all that stuff. There are other people in the office that he can choose.

Go for it.....to civilians, Soldier of the month/year/whatever....makes you look like a rockstar

[CABRYANT41234]

AR-600-8-19 para. 5–11. Declination of selection board consideration.
a. A Soldier who is within the zone of consideration for promotion may decline such consideration before his or her
promotion packet is assembled and sent to the promotion board. Once the packet has been sent to the board, the Soldier
cannot decline consideration. However, if selected and placed on the PPRL, the Soldier may request removal from the
list per paragraph 5–27c.
b. A declination of board consideration will be a written statement signed by the Soldier, witnessed by an NCO or
officer, and inserted in the Soldier’s MPF. The declination will remain in effect for any subsequent boards unless the
Soldier changes his or her mind and requests board consideration. In this event, the declination will be removed from
the MPF, annotated by the custodian to indicate the declination was withdrawn on a specified date, retained by the
custodian until the next regular board is convened, and then destroyed.
c. When a Soldier declines promotion consideration, it is essential that the Soldier’s immediate supervisor and the
CDR determine the reason for the declination and provide adequate counseling.

If everyone answerd simple questions like this based on Military Regulation, it sure would save a lot of time.

[KMSTORM64]

Just because they send you to the board doesn't mean you have to be an e4p. You could always go there forgetting everything. "i dont recall at this time sir." If they dont think you are ready they wont give you promotable status. Just a suggestion.



That is the best way to make sure you never go again, any time soon. You have the option of reporting tot he president of the board and telling them you had planned on re-classing and did not feel it would be a benefit to the service to take a slot from some one else. I would have more respect for some one who did that than act the fool.

[ECKSRAY]

LOL today my supervisor said I'm going to the Soldier of the month board next month. I said no I'm not, I don't wanna do that. He jokes and stuff but I hope he's not serious cause I'm not doing all that stuff. There are other people in the office that he can choose.

Reading this stuff is crazy! The stuff perpetuated on this blog is what is wrong with Soldiers in the Army today.

BLUF: As a Senior NCO I can direct any of my Soldiers to go to the board. It's called TRAINING AND PROFESSIONAL DEVELOPMENT!

I wish I would have a Soldier tell me they are not going to do something. First I would be very professional and talk with the Soldier about their responsibility to better themselves as a Soldier regardless of whether they were getting out or felt they were not prepared (this board will work on their preparation).

If the Soldier still tried to tell me they didn't want to go (after I had channeled my anger in a positive manner) It will be a bad day for that individual! I would counsel that individual, come up with some corrective training, recommmend UCMJ to the CDR in the form of an Article 15, Summarized Proceedings for violation of Article 92, Failure to obey an order, so I could get them on some extra duty and work the dog S*** out of them!

[brak]

Reading this stuff is crazy! The stuff perpetuated on this blog is what is wrong with Soldiers in the Army today.

BLUF: As a Senior NCO I can direct any of my Soldiers to go to the board. It's called TRAINING AND PROFESSIONAL DEVELOPMENT!

I wish I would have a Soldier tell me they are not going to do something. First I would be very professional and talk with the Soldier about their responsibility to better themselves as a Soldier regardless of whether they were getting out or felt they were not prepared (this board will work on their preparation).

If the Soldier still tried to tell me they didn't want to go (after I had channeled my anger in a positive manner) It will be a bad day for that individual! I would counsel that individual, come up with some corrective training, recommmend UCMJ to the CDR in the form of an Article 15, Summarized Proceedings for violation of Article 92, Failure to obey an order, so I could get them on some extra duty and work the dog S*** out of them!

Well, if a Soldier was on the teetertotter about staying in, this would definitely drive them out. While I agree that if Soldiers do plan to stay in, they should be required to advance if able. No sense in forcing them to go as soon as they hit the secondary zone, but once they hit the primary, they should be ready to step up.

I do not agree with, or see the sense in, "forcing" Soldiers to attend the board when they do not have the time left in to pin on the next grade. Counsel them on their eligibility and give them the "don't sell yourself short" speech, and then let them make the decision. What's to be gained by forcing them to go to the board? Threats of corrective training and UCMJ action do not retain Soldiers. If the Soldier re-enlists and then wants to go, no harm no foul. Usually we're not talking about Soldiers closing in our their RCP. On of the steps of building junior leaders is empowering them. Let them participate in their own success and manage their own careers, not have it dictated to them.

[ECKSRAY]

Well, if a Soldier was on the teetertotter about staying in, this would definitely drive them out. While I agree that if Soldiers do plan to stay in, they should be required to advance if able. No sense in forcing them to go as soon as they hit the secondary zone, but once they hit the primary, they should be ready to step up.

I do not agree with, or see the sense in, "forcing" Soldiers to attend the board when they do not have the time left in to pin on the next grade. Counsel them on their eligibility and give them the "don't sell yourself short" speech, and then let them make the decision. What's to be gained by forcing them to go to the board? Threats of corrective training and UCMJ action do not retain Soldiers. If the Soldier re-enlists and then wants to go, no harm no foul. Usually we're not talking about Soldiers closing in our their RCP. On of the steps of building junior leaders is empowering them. Let them participate in their own success and manage their own careers, not have it dictated to them.

Hey that's what I love about the Army today. Hugs and High-Fives!

SPC to the SFC: Hey Sarge, I am not going to the board and you can't make me 'cause I am getting out.

SFC to the SPC: Well SPC, even though I have a responsibility to train, educate and prepare you for positions of greaty authority, your right..I can't force you...but "don't sell yourself short!" You have all the makings of a great NCO in you and I feel you should go to the board!

SPC to the SFC: Yeah Sarge, that briefs well but. It's not going to happen.

SFC to the SPC: Okay SPC, whatever you want to do is okay with me.

SPC to the other PFC's and SPC's: Hey, if you don't want to go to the board just tell Sarge what I said and besides, he can't make you.

SFC to the 1SG: Hey 1SG, most of my PFC's and SPC's are getting out or don't want to go to the board, so I counseled them and told them it was okay with me if they didn't.

1SG to the SFC: Well that's fine PSG. I had the same choices when I was a SPC and you did the right thing. Ask them if they want to do SGT Time training this week.

1SG to the CSM: Hey CSM, we feel that it is the Soldiers choice to go to the board. Based on that feeling, I am not sending anyone to the SOM/NCO Boards or to the promotion board this month. When they feel like they are ready to go, then I will update my OML and shoot you an email.

CSM: That's fine 1SG. I love Hugs and High-Fives! Let me know when you have someone that wants to come and I will set up a board.

BN CSM to the BDE CSM: Hey CSM, we need to cancel the BDE boards this month, I don't have any SPC that want to go to the BN Boards so I won't have anyone for your boards. They plan on getting out.

BDE CSM to BN CSM: Hugs and High-Five's CSM, Hugs and High-Five's!

WTF, Over?

[eddiegom3z]

I personally think that nobody should get forced to go the board. Obvisiously if the soldier refuses to go to the board, then he is not confident and should not be sent. I paid my due's, i've earned what I have and where im at, i would not like to have a Team Leader or a peer that was never up to par to my left or my right just because he was forced to go to the board. Who ever forces soldiers to go to the board that don't want to go or that are not ready (especially if your not mentoring them) is making my life a living hell!!! Thanks alot!!! Instead of training and taking care of my squad, now i have to counsel a sorry @%% Team Leader that doesn't know how to do his job. Tango Mike

[CarryOn]

If you don't want to attend, tell your squad leader or platoon sergeant. Let them know your reason(s) for not wanting to attend, you do not have to be an android and accept anything and everything.

If your chain of command (yes your sqaud leader and platoon sergeant) can't come to understand your reasons, then represent them at the promotion board by embarassing them. Thats right. Give them what they want, and don't answer anything correct, have your uniform jacked up, show up late, and I am sure you won't get recommended for promotion.

Do keep in mind that no matter what you want, the military is looking for excuses to kick folks out.

If it is tolerable, makes sense, or is smart, then it is fine to follow. If its dumb, stupid and ignorant, then that is what you are if you follow. You can still be disciplined and not be a dumb%%%

Carry On...

[CarryOn]

FACT: People in the military get out of the military early because people in the military piss one another off by not listeining to others.

FACT: Their are very few people in position of authority who actually deserve that position, hence, their experience at authority, versus managing personell, is a flop and their soldiers see right through them.

FACT: If a Soldier has a different career goal than his/her chain of command wants, then the chain of command should support the Soldier, elswise, the chain of command fails that soldier by not helping that Soldier with their career goal

FACT: No one (to include CSM's give a rats a&& about the OML. All we care about are numbers. If you have to make numbers by screwing another Soldier out of their career goal, then that is all you get accomplished.

FACT: Most early, force made promotions lead to failure in leadership, lack of experience, lack of occupational knowledge, and a weak to moderate NCOER that actually hurts the Soldier in the long run.

FACT: Don't promote numbers, promote quality. If they don't want to go, dont send them, they obviously don't need to be promoted or advanced. Chose someone who wants it and will fight to earn it and keep it.

Carry On...

[Jdaniel394]

I agree they can, but it does not make sense for them to be forced. If a Soldier is forced to go to the board that means an NCO was forced to sponsor him. The NCOs time would be much more wisely spent helping a Soldier who wants to go to the board study.

[ECKSRAY]

If you don't want to attend, tell your squad leader or platoon sergeant. Let them know your reason(s) for not wanting to attend, you do not have to be an android and accept anything and everything.

If your chain of command (yes your sqaud leader and platoon sergeant) can't come to understand your reasons, then represent them at the promotion board by embarassing them. Thats right. Give them what they want, and don't answer anything correct, have your uniform jacked up, show up late, and I am sure you won't get recommended for promotion.

Do keep in mind that no matter what you want, the military is looking for excuses to kick folks out.

If it is tolerable, makes sense, or is smart, then it is fine to follow. If its dumb, stupid and ignorant, then that is what you are if you follow. You can still be disciplined and not be a dumb%%%

Carry On...

Often in the military, one will find themselves in a job they don't like or having to do something that they do not particularly want to do.

A Professional Soldier (yes…this is a profession) is going to carry out their assigned task professionally and to the best of their ability.

To suggest that a Soldier should go into a promotion or SOM/NCO board and embarrass themselves, their NCO’s, and their Unit is a travesty and indicates that you are not worthy of wearing the uniform. Because anyone who would recommend a young Soldier do something like that is teaching that Soldier that they should not have the integrity and commitment to complete their assigned mission. What kind of leader are you?

This is an All-Volunteer Army. Volunteering for something means you sometimes get marching orders and you just need to execute.

Regardless of future career goals and desires, you are still in the Army until the day that DA 214 is in your hands and you are driving off post. Up until that time and about 30 days after, you are being paid to be a Soldier.

Leaders have responsibility to train and educate Soldiers. Preparing for boards is all part of professional development, regardless of whether or not it leads to promotion.

It is obvious that some of you need to reassess what type of leaders you are.

[CarryOn]

ESKSRAY;

This column is not for you, it is for the person who wants to know if they can be made to go to a promotion board. The fact is, even though your ill experience doesn't think so, is that no... they can not be made. And if the retarded leader choses to push the issue, then the soldier should give that NCO what he or she deserves, and that is... a sub standard Soldier.

In other words... if the Soldier is not ready, or nor worthy, then the Soldier should not be recommneded. If you send a piece of SH** to a promotion board, and he/she gets promoted, then you produce the same.

Now since you did decide to intervene, and try and get involved with this conversation, you may want to educate yourself, rehearse what you intend to say, and then try and compete with me. Until then, Carry On!

Young readers and or recruits... trust me, their are few people that will tell you the truth, the others will hide the truth behind their fake, boy scout mentality and pretend to know the answer; when the sad truth is that your baby sister knows more about the truth.

What king of leader am I ? I am the kind of leader that will drag you out in public, embarass you, and then send you home crying without even thanking you for trying. Now CARRY ON!

:cool:

[SJray]

In regards to this comment, I have to say that this way of thinking is not always the smart one. Yes we are in the army and yes we have to follow orders unless in is immoral or illegal. The army harps on quote on quote building leader, but how can you force someone to be something that they feel that they are not ready to do. I personally believe that one cannot build a leader, it is natural and has to be developed, and not by going to those farly outdated NCOES schools. A true leader will emerge when given the chance, and one that has those qualities will show them, but may need some guidance by another leader. Another caveat to that statement is that, just because you have the rank, does not always mean that you are a leader. Furthermore as far as the board is concerned, it is obsurd to think that this is a way of shining, or to think that it can determine if one should be promoted. I can take a high speed 6th grader, give him a study guide and tell him to study it for three months, teach him how to march and wear the uniform, and take him to the same board. So now that 6th grader is now qualified to be a NCO.....are you kidding me!!!!! It is only those who have never been to a real professional job interview, who think that a military board is a way of shining...(it is only rope memorization)! This is coming from a former MSG, who saw the light and went officer!

[SJray]

I have to say that I agree with you whole heartly!!!!

[SJray]

Hey that's what I love about the Army today. Hugs and High-Fives!
SPC to the SFC: Hey Sarge, I am not going to the board and you can't make me 'cause I am getting out.

SFC to the SPC: Well SPC, even though I have a responsibility to train, educate and prepare you for positions of greaty authority, your right..I can't force you...but "don't sell yourself short!" You have all the makings of a great NCO in you and I feel you should go to the board!

SPC to the SFC: Yeah Sarge, that briefs well but. It's not going to happen.

SFC to the SPC: Okay SPC, whatever you want to do is okay with me.

SPC to the other PFC's and SPC's: Hey, if you don't want to go to the board just tell Sarge what I said and besides, he can't make you.

SFC to the 1SG: Hey 1SG, most of my PFC's and SPC's are getting out or don't want to go to the board, so I counseled them and told them it was okay with me if they didn't.

1SG to the SFC: Well that's fine PSG. I had the same choices when I was a SPC and you did the right thing. Ask them if they want to do SGT Time training this week.

1SG to the CSM: Hey CSM, we feel that it is the Soldiers choice to go to the board. Based on that feeling, I am not sending anyone to the SOM/NCO Boards or to the promotion board this month. When they feel like they are ready to go, then I will update my OML and shoot you an email.

CSM: That's fine 1SG. I love Hugs and High-Fives! Let me know when you have someone that wants to come and I will set up a board.

BN CSM to the BDE CSM: Hey CSM, we need to cancel the BDE boards this month, I don't have any SPC that want to go to the BN Boards so I won't have anyone for your boards. They plan on getting out.

BDE CSM to BN CSM: Hugs and High-Five's CSM, Hugs and High-Five's!

WTF, Over?

it is easy to tell that you live by every regualtion in the army, and will probably continue to do so once you reitre...not trying to be rude.....lol

[SGT_B]

There are ways of forcing a soldier to do what the chain of command wants...that being said, the question is what leader would want to send a soldier before a promotion board, when they do not want to go. That is the most stupid thing I have ever heard of. Why would those leaders want to take a chance that they will be promoted?
It sounds like that whole chain of command needs to rethink this situation, its FUBAR.

[ECKSRAY]

ESKSRAY;

This column is not for you, it is for the person who wants to know if they can be made to go to a promotion board. The fact is, even though your ill experience doesn't think so, is that no... they can not be made. And if the retarded leader choses to push the issue, then the soldier should give that NCO what he or she deserves, and that is... a sub standard Soldier.

In other words... if the Soldier is not ready, or nor worthy, then the Soldier should not be recommneded. If you send a piece of SH** to a promotion board, and he/she gets promoted, then you produce the same.

Now since you did decide to intervene, and try and get involved with this conversation, you may want to educate yourself, rehearse what you intend to say, and then try and compete with me. Until then, Carry On!

Young readers and or recruits... trust me, their are few people that will tell you the truth, the others will hide the truth behind their fake, boy scout mentality and pretend to know the answer; when the sad truth is that your baby sister knows more about the truth.

What king of leader am I ? I am the kind of leader that will drag you out in public, embarass you, and then send you home crying without even thanking you for trying. Now CARRY ON!

:cool:

It is obvious that Mr/Ms. Carry On is more of a lout than any type leader.

The advice he/she would give a Soldier would no doubt set them up for failure. He/she seems to have a difficult time wrapping his/her mind around the concept of professional development, which tells me they probably don't professionally develop any Soldiers (if they even have anyone working for them) and they lack some critical thinking skills. For the Soldiers that are exiting the Army, SOM/NCO boards will also helping them with their confidence and the interviewing skills they will need in the civilian job market.

I imagine Carry On has been embarrassed in public themselves, probably for their lack of professionalism, leadership or both.

A reduction board would probably be more applicable for Carry On.

(P.S. Carry On is more like one of those barracks lawyers every unit has)

[CarryOn]

Esksray,

It is a shame that you can not even stay focussed on the subject at hand. This entire column was to answer another Soldiers question. Instead, you ignored the question, came up with some dipshi*, coward of an excuse, and then decided to challenge my correct, and intellegent answer. You are the epitemy of a system failure that got promoted, the same piece of Sh** I have been talking about, no doubt.

A Soldier asked a question, and you, a premadonna person assumes they know an answer, so instead of saying something smart or brilliant, you opened your mouth, and out comes your lack of intelligence, like what you have done so far in this forum. And any Soldier sees right through you.

You should have the lowest private in your chain of command proof read your posts and commnets before embarrasing yourself any further.

The only thing I have received from your responses so far is that you are a sad little person who is a afraid of reality and must say "yes sir, yes sir" anytime he hears an order. You are the reason why no one should be made to go to a promotion board, because all we get to promote are the ones who can't think for themselves, and then we get to watch you quiver in combat. You are the reason why we should not send just anyone to a board.

Another thing Genius... the promotion boards do not, can not, and will never help anyone get a job on the civilian sector. However, getting an education higher than a GED (unlike our friend ESKSRAY) will actually help you get a job on the civilian market. Listening to someone like Eskray will not only keep you unemployed but might also get you kicked in the mouth.

Now, since you have once again decided to make this column about you and have decided to debate with me instead of listening, I will continue posting in other areas, so I dont feel like I have to succumb to your ignorant thinking and ill retarted responses.

For the Soldier who originally posted their question and instead recieved the ignorant responses from ESKSRAY, I am sorry that instead of answering your question, ESKSRAYdecided to make it a bit&& session about them. Obvioulsy they are just as confused as the next private.

You may carry on now~ ~
:D

[SJray]

Esksray,

It is a shame that you can not even stay focussed on the subject at hand. This entire column was to answer another Soldiers question. Instead, you ignored the question, came up with some dipshi*, coward of an excuse, and then decided to challenge my correct, and intellegent answer. You are the epitemy of a system failure that got promoted, the same piece of Sh** I have been talking about, no doubt.

A Soldier asked a question, and you, a premadonna person assumes they know an answer, so instead of saying something smart or brilliant, you opened your mouth, and out comes your lack of intelligence, like what you have done so far in this forum. And any Soldier sees right through you.

You should have the lowest private in your chain of command proof read your posts and commnets before embarrasing yourself any further.

The only thing I have received from your responses so far is that you are a sad little person who is a afraid of reality and must say "yes sir, yes sir" anytime he hears an order. You are the reason why no one should be made to go to a promotion board, because all we get to promote are the ones who can't think for themselves, and then we get to watch you quiver in combat. You are the reason why we should not send just anyone to a board.

Another thing Genius... the promotion boards do not, can not, and will never help anyone get a job on the civilian sector. However, getting an education higher than a GED (unlike our friend ESKSRAY) will actually help you get a job on the civilian market. Listening to someone like Eskray will not only keep you unemployed but might also get you kicked in the mouth.

Now, since you have once again decided to make this column about you and have decided to debate with me instead of listening, I will continue posting in other areas, so I dont feel like I have to succumb to your ignorant thinking and ill retarted responses.

For the Soldier who originally posted their question and instead recieved the ignorant responses from ESKSRAY, I am sorry that instead of answering your question, ESKSRAYdecided to make it a bit&& session about them. Obvioulsy they are just as confused as the next private.

You may carry on now~ ~
:D

I totally agree with you on this guy. He seems like the guy that has been in the army for a million years, and is brainwashed into thinking things like the silly board will benefit him in a job interview. He will be the guy to retire and still wear his rank and metals on his retired hat....lol. Another brainwashed lost army soul. I hope that he nevers comes to the dark side, with this non-sense....... Once again this is coming from a former MSG who saw the light and went officer.

[dbierwi440]

I was standing in a "blue water sauna" at JB Balad and read this ditty. "A small mind is easily filled with Hooah" . I could not help but laugh and realize that this had been probably written by one of the many US Air Force members here. The promotion board is exactly what has just been finally discussed. It's a tool for senior enlisted to fluff up their NCOER! Most Army members don't work in their MOS and only maybe in time of war work. The remainder is sadly a race for promotion and no concentration on civilian education. I have met multiple E-6,7,8's who are retiring with very little education. I don't really know what they were thinking. I could keep writing but won't. :)

[arun.prasad.ojha]

I think it is necessary, because facing promotion board is for promotion. If anyone get promoted he not only get rank but rank comes lots of responsibilities toward Nation,Military service,soldiers. So I believe it is good to know where you are by facing board.

[J25]

Most units nowadays, any board at the BN level are "good ole boy" boards. Alot of the time if a soldier is well known for a certain area (IE: Physical Fitness) that soldier its in and out.....There are soldiers getting promoted to the rank of Sergeant nowadays that should never put the rank on in the first place. It makes me sick to see soldiers like this. This is why alot of soldiers are getting out now a days, due to the fact that some leaders arent doing their checks and only sending soldiers who excel in one or two areas instead of being "all-around."

Should soldiers be forced to a board in the Army? Absolutely not. Its setting soldiers up for failure if they arent ready and it makes leaders look worse because they have to live with the fact they sponsored that soldier...it begins to question the integrity of that leader by a long shot.

Eskray, I am probably describing you there.....

CarryOn, you seem like the type that any soldier should follow into combat.

Thats my two cents, take it for what its worth

[acesfilter]

AR-600-8-19 para. 5–11. Declination of selection board consideration.
a. A Soldier who is within the zone of consideration for promotion may decline such consideration before his or her
promotion packet is assembled and sent to the promotion board. Once the packet has been sent to the board, the Soldier
cannot decline consideration. However, if selected and placed on the PPRL, the Soldier may request removal from the
list per paragraph 5–27c.
b. A declination of board consideration will be a written statement signed by the Soldier, witnessed by an NCO or
officer, and inserted in the Soldier’s MPF. The declination will remain in effect for any subsequent boards unless the
Soldier changes his or her mind and requests board consideration. In this event, the declination will be removed from
the MPF, annotated by the custodian to indicate the declination was withdrawn on a specified date, retained by the
custodian until the next regular board is convened, and then destroyed.
c. When a Soldier declines promotion consideration, it is essential that the Soldier’s immediate supervisor and the
CDR determine the reason for the declination and provide adequate counseling.

Proof positive that you cannot "force" a Soldier to attend a promotion board. You can only bully and coerce them to go. There's a difference.

Of course, any CoC that does this seriously needs to do some self examining and ask themselves exactly how this is going to benefit the United States Army.

[Creaminess]

I'll beat this dead horse a little bit more, just to add my own two cents...

For the original poster, glad to hear things worked out. No leader in their right mind would screw a Soldier out of a reenlistment option, and I'm glad your leadership did the right thing.

In other cases, if you're fully eligible for the board, you are required to be either recommended to go or counseled on why you're not going. That's IAW AR 600-8-19. If you don't want to go but have been recommended, you should talk with your first-line supervisor and tell him/her that you don't want to attend and why. If they continue to force the issue, you should take it to the next level, either your squad leader (if that's not your first-line supervisor) or your platoon sergeant. Continue on to the first sergeant and command sergeant major, if necessary. I think any good senior leader worth their salt will work with you to either give you a reasonable amount of time to prepare for the board or to grant your wish to not appear before the board.

While I think it's a bad idea to show up your leadership by purposely bombing the board (if you're still forced to go for some reason), I can't say the leadership wouldn't have brought that one themselves by still sending you even though you made it clear you don't want to attend. I don't recommend tanking at the board unless that's a last resort, because not only does that lessen your worth in the eyes of your leaders and the board members, but it also can come back to haunt you if you someday have a change of heart and decide you want to become promotable after all.

Never in my career have I forced a Soldier, fully eligible or eligible with a waiver, to attend a board. That's where you need to counsel and have a two-way conversation about what the Soldier wants to do in his or her career and why. I have, however, given encouragement to the Soldier to become promotable by highlighting to positives of it and countering negatives he or she gave, if appropriate. In the end, though, that decision should rest with the Soldier, so long as they realize what the implications are of declining to be boarded. But I have never shut the door on the possibility of a Soldier boarding later when he/she is ready.

I take the same approach when it comes to Soldiers reenlisting. Sure, I want the Army to keep quality Soldiers. But that Soldier has to WANT to stay in the Army. If you coerce a Soldier into reenlisting, guess what? That Soldier is stuck with that contract, not you. I tell Soldiers why I stayed in and why I think they should as well, if that is indeed what I think they should do. But I don't threaten them with "You'll never get a job on the outside" or anything like that, because by doing that, I am essentially telling them that they're so worthless that only a pathetic organization like the Army would want them. Why am I going to tell a Soldier that the Army is his/her only option when it gives the impression that the Army doesn't care who it keeps? Maybe the Army as a whole doesn't care, but leaders who care want to ensure that those who are good (or have the potential to become good) stay while shepherding those who don't belong out the door. Again, the Soldier is stuck with the consequences of his/her decision, and oftentimes the Soldier's family is stuck too.

Forcing a Soldier to board gives you a reluctant leader who's likely not ready for the challenge of the next rank, and that leader can then pass his/her bad attitude and outlook to subordinates. It has a cascading effect. Of course not every Soldier that leader has will share the bad attributes of the leader who was forced to board and then forced into that leadership position, but who knows how many individuals ultimately will be tainted by one bad leader?

The days of career Specialists and Privates First Class are over. In the past, I've worked for two NCOs who both retired as Sergeants at 20 years, because they didn't have the drive to go further. Nowadays, that doesn't cut it. But I have no problem having a Specialist working under me who has a great attitude and is proficient, yet has no aspirations to be promoted further. And when that Specialist meets his/her RCP, as long as the Specialist's leaders in the past have done the right things through counseling and motivating that Soldier, the Specialist will have nobody to blame but himself/herself when forced out of the Army for not making rank. We can only do so much; the rest is up to those Soldiers.

[CUSDADDY]

Promotion board is not for who is ready to be an NCO but who has potential, it is up the NCOs to get them ready, I've had plenty of good NCOs that I had to force to go to the board. When they start crying, just tell them to shut up and drive on.

[Creaminess]

Promotion board is not for who is ready to be an NCO but who has potential, it is up the NCOs to get them ready, I've had plenty of good NCOs that I had to force to go to the board. When they start crying, just tell them to shut up and drive on.

If I'm reading this right, you should force somebody to board and THEN get them ready to be an NCO? That doesn't make any sense to me. Yes, promotions are based on potential, but they have to exhibit that potential before they're boarded. With almost instantaneous promotion now after a board, you don't have time to groom somebody AFTER they've boarded for the rank they're about to attain.

[MCGYVER]

Nope but they can be "severely encouraged" to do so. Just like when AER or CFC donation time comes around. We've all seen it first hand.

[CarryOn]

Creaminess,

It almost sounds like you and I are the only ones in this forum that has ever spent time in the military, or at least made the rank higher than a Specialist. I concur with your remarks, and, I do not have any idea what Cusdaddy or McGyver are trying to convey.

There are leaders, and there are others who will try to become one, until they cross that threshold, you cannot force a mentality on them. You can mold, build, correct, train, and lead them to a career goal, but you cannot force it on them, or they will shut down and prove you wrong, just to prove you wrong.

As for the rest of you who think you can force anything on anyone, let me enlighten your mind and say you are the same type of person I would rip apart in front of your troops or subordinates, just to show them that you are nothing, and you have gained nothing. Stop trying to screw your Soldiers, and instead, lead them, guide them and train them for tomorrow.

Cusdaddy... if you really think you have the time to teach a Soldier how to be an NCO after you have already promoted them to an NCO, then you are a very brilliant person, and need to be working at the Pentagon with the Generals because not even they know how to do that.

You will have an Army of imbasals. The bling leading the blind, or the dumb leading the dumber.

Now Carry On!

[MCGYVER]

"You will have an Army of imbasals. The bling leading the blind" I have to infer that you actually meant "imbeciles" and "Blind leading the blind". Sometimes you have to kick a Soldier in the ass to get him to do what you want (or what is actually good for them). You sound like a candy daddy that is more concerned with the Soldiers feelings than doing what is right. The Hard right is hard for a reason.

[CarryOn]

"You will have an Army of imbasals. The bling leading the blind" I have to infer that you actually meant "imbeciles" and "Blind leading the blind". Sometimes you have to kick a Soldier in the ass to get him to do what you want (or what is actually good for them). You sound like a candy daddy that is more concerned with the Soldiers feelings than doing what is right. The Hard right is hard for a reason.

Again, there are leaders, and then there are folks like you (McGyver).

This forum is not a spelling bee either, but thank you for correcting my grammer. I am certain your G.E.D. will come in handy for you some other time in your life.

Although I do agree with kicking a Soldier in the ass when I need him/her to do something, promoting a Soldier who is not ready, or is not deserving is not doing anyone a favor, it is merely promoting to fill numbers, thus increasing the amount of people who lead like you do, from a keyboard.

Educated yourself in what is right before trying to challenge what I already know is right. Imbecile!

Spell check that for me now, and then... Carry On!:D

[CarryOn]

Educate(d) yourself was intentionally left incorrect to see if mcgyver could spell check it for me

Now have a good day and... Carry On!

[MCGYVER]

Some day I could maybe measure up to your high standards carrion (yeah, look that up you pogue). If a Soldier is not capable of being a leader I don't send him to the board, too easy. If he is and simply doesn't want to then I "encourage" him and counsel him to do what's right for him, his family and the Army. Yeah, you know what works allright. You're a damn genius. You should be a fucking General. If you recall, you were the first one to start using words that you don't know how to spell. You're a class act buddy. Have a nice day cupcake. Oh, I have an award for you:
http://pclanparty.com/forum_pix/assclown.jpg

[CarryOn]

Some day I could maybe measure up to your high standards carrion (yeah, look that up you pogue). If a Soldier is not capable of being a leader I don't send him to the board, too easy. If he is and simply doesn't want to then I "encourage" him and counsel him to do what's right for him, his family and the Army. Yeah, you know what works allright. You're a damn genius. You should be a fucking General. If you recall, you were the first one to start using words that you don't know how to spell. You're a class act buddy. Have a nice day cupcake. Oh, I have an award for you:
http://pclanparty.com/forum_pix/assclown.jpg

McGyver,

Again... a well rounded use of your G.E.D., your family would be proud. Now go an google some more responses, and until then... Carry On.

[Creaminess]

"You will have an Army of imbasals. The bling leading the blind" I have to infer that you actually meant "imbeciles" and "Blind leading the blind". Sometimes you have to kick a Soldier in the ass to get him to do what you want (or what is actually good for them). You sound like a candy daddy that is more concerned with the Soldiers feelings than doing what is right. The Hard right is hard for a reason.

Kicking a Soldier in the ass to get him to do what you want only works so far. You can't develop leadership that way. Unless you plan to follow that Soldier the rest of his career to keep "motivating" him, that's a short-term fix. Ultimately, it's up to the individual to WANT to do it. There are things you can force a Soldier to do, but you can't force him to be a leader.

[MCGYVER]

There are also ways of influencing Soldiers where they don't feel forced but they still do what you want. Nobody said you could force a Soldier to be a leader, we were simply talking about getting them to go to the promotion board. Two completely different animals.

[Creaminess]

There are also ways of influencing Soldiers where they don't feel forced but they still do what you want. Nobody said you could force a Soldier to be a leader, we were simply talking about getting them to go to the promotion board. Two completely different animals.

That's true, but what happens to a Soldier who doesn't want to be a leader when he/she gets promoted? Now you've got somebody who was forced to go to the board in a leadership position who doesn't want to do it or isn't ready to do it, and that bad leadership (or lack of leadership at all) is felt by the subordinates.

Too many people are thinking about forcing a Soldier to go to the board but not the consequences of what happens once that Soldier is promoted and in a position of influence.

[MCGYVER]

The Army does not promote you based on your desire, they promote you based on your potential. If a Soldier didn't have potential I wouldn't send him to the board. He can have plenty of potential without desire. Quite often you don't see their true colors until they are put in the position.

[Creaminess]

The Army does not promote you based on your desire, they promote you based on your potential. If a Soldier didn't have potential I wouldn't send him to the board. He can have plenty of potential without desire. Quite often you don't see their true colors until they are put in the position.

I'll agree with you on that. You never know how somebody will truly perform until they're faced with that situation. Absolutely true.

I think the original poster is a Soldier who does not want to board and is asking if he can be forced to go to the board. If you have somebody you think who has potential but no desire whatsoever, would you force them to board? I wouldn't, but I know it happens.

[CarryOn]

The Army does not promote you based on your desire, they promote you based on your potential. If a Soldier didn't have potential I wouldn't send him to the board. He can have plenty of potential without desire. Quite often you don't see their true colors until they are put in the position.

If a Soldier has potential, there is no need to "kick him in the a@@", he/she will want to attend a board because they have been led along the way by their leader(s). If a Soldier states that they do not want to go to a board, then you counsel that individual, and select someone else to go to the board.
The entire debate so far was do we promote a tird, or force a tird into a promotion. The answer is no, we as leaders should select based on potential and quality and the fact is if they claim or act like they don't want to go, then I have another 20 to pick from that do want to go and also have the potential.

We continue to mold that Soldier, but we cannot force something on them that they already do not possess, a leader is born and molded over time. I think we all have great ideas, and know what we mean.

Carry On

[MCGYVER]

Therein lies the rub. If they don't want to go it is very similar to them not wanting to get out of the rack and do P.T. (at least in my book). If you TELL them they are going and to prepare for it then they WILL do so or they'll embarrass you, themselves and the team. If they embarrass the team they will be "correctively trained" for thirty days and appear before the next board. They WILL learn many aspects of leadership from preparing for the board and appearing before the board. This is not to say that they WILL definitely be promoted. There are plenty of ways to stop that as well. Leaders are not born, they are (for the most part) products of their environment and the leaders that they've had.

[b2144]

I can tell by alot of the comments on here that there are alot of half rights and half wrongs.

Can a soldier be made to go to a promotion board? No he cant, but he must do the proper things to decline it.

Can a Soldier be made to go to a Soldier of the Month/Quarter Board or NCO of the Month/Quarter board? Yes they can be made to do those. How ever, if the said Soldier/NCO states that they dont want to go (notice I said "dont want to go" and not "I will not go"), that isnt disobeying any order whatso ever. A Soldier/NCO can say they dont want to do something all day long. Saying they will not go is the potential for disobeying, not saying they dont want to go.

Is not showing up at their appointed place of duty AWOL? Um no, must be 24+ hours to be AWOL, course a non-educated NCO would of course threaten their subordinates with that, which of course isnt the right type of leadership we need in the Army.

I have been in the army now for just over 17 years, i have recommended soldiers for the promotion board and Soldier/NCO of the month/year boards, I have also not recommended ones. Especially for the Soldier/NCO of the Month/Year. When i talk to someone about going, and they express their concerns abotu not wanting to go, it also makes me rething about sending them, for those boards you want ot send your best. Someone who doesnt want to go may not be the best. I have sent ones that were reluctant, because they did just need that nudge to excel. But i sent them because i knew them, i took the time as every leader should, and get to know my subordinates. I have also pushed for a solder to not go to a promotion board because they werent ready, though they were in the primary zone, though the Command wanted them to go because of them being in the primary. Guess what? They didnt go, as every Leader should, I had the counselling to back up the reasons why, the plans of actions where being worked on what needed to be inproved in order for him to get my recommendation to go, he knew, he was being councelled, and guess what? He didnt go until the plans of actions were completed and his deficiences were fixed.

To those who say suck it up and do as you are told. to those who make comments about hugs and high-fives. Sad to say, that people like you need to do a self evaluation and do a spot check on yourselves. Those are policies of our Army, made by Leaders above us. So quit being hypocritical and telling your subordinates to do what they are told, when you yourself do not accept and support the changes that the leaders above you are making to this army. Either step up to what YOU are told to do by the Amry Leadership has said through the changes they have made to how the Army operates, or get out. As the likes of you always say, the army doesnt need people who cant follow the rules and regulations made by the leaders above them, listen to what you yourself say for one.

one last comment on the long thread of comments. When a Soldier says they wont go or dont want to go to any board of any type. Instead of yelling at them, or forcible making them go with threats of ucmj/corrective action take the time to get to know them better, find out what motivates them, find out the WHY they dont want to go. Do what leaders do, get to know their Soldiers, motivate them (and not necacarily by threatening them with ucmj or corrective action/training or working the crap out of them). If all a Leader can do to get someone to do something is through force/threatening/fear, well they arent that good of a leader. A leader does not lead through fear, he leads from people wanting to follow him/her. He leads by example. Just because you where forced to do something doesnt mean subordinates should. For example, the army says hazing is wrong and illegal, yet it still goes on by some leaders/soldiers because it happened to them, though policy states its wrong and should not happen. Another perfect example of how Leaders can be hypocritical and set the wrong example and not wal the walk.

[Creaminess]

one last comment on the long thread of comments. When a Soldier says they wont go or dont want to go to any board of any type. Instead of yelling at them, or forcible making them go with threats of ucmj/corrective action take the time to get to know them better, find out what motivates them, find out the WHY they dont want to go. Do what leaders do, get to know their Soldiers, motivate them (and not necacarily by threatening them with ucmj or corrective action/training or working the crap out of them). If all a Leader can do to get someone to do something is through force/threatening/fear, well they arent that good of a leader. A leader does not lead through fear, he leads from people wanting to follow him/her. He leads by example. Just because you where forced to do something doesnt mean subordinates should. For example, the army says hazing is wrong and illegal, yet it still goes on by some leaders/soldiers because it happened to them, though policy states its wrong and should not happen. Another perfect example of how Leaders can be hypocritical and set the wrong example and not wal the walk.

You, my friend, are right on target.

[MCGYVER]

b2144, the regulations also state that the only authorized sexual position is the missionary position. Do you follow all the regs or just the ones that suit you?

Why would you imply that I don't already know my Soldier if I am making him go to a board? If he wasn't capable and competent (potential) then I wouldn't send him to the board. I've had many, many Soldiers over the years and I've had some that simply didn't care to go to the board, some that were scared to go to the board, some that were ambivalent about going to the board and others that really wanted to go to the board. I sent (at different times in my career) members of every group to the board. Why? Because a) I was told to by my superiors b) it was for the good of the Soldier, unit, team and the Army c) it was the right thing to do d) I believed the Soldier was ready, willing and able to win or pass the board.

Obviously sometimes it works out and sometimes it doesn't. Quite often the reason a Soldier says he doesn't want to go to the board is because he has a fear of failure. Sometimes the only way to get over a phobia is to face it (or be forced to face it) head on. As a leader you have to be prepared (and capable) of getting a Soldier to do what they fear the most. If you are incable or unwilling to do so then you need to find a new profession.

[CarryOn]

Therein lies the rub. If they don't want to go it is very similar to them not wanting to get out of the rack and do P.T. (at least in my book). If you TELL them they are going and to prepare for it then they WILL do so or they'll embarrass you, themselves and the team. If they embarrass the team they will be "correctively trained" for thirty days and appear before the next board. They WILL learn many aspects of leadership from preparing for the board and appearing before the board. This is not to say that they WILL definitely be promoted. There are plenty of ways to stop that as well. Leaders are not born, they are (for the most part) products of their environment and the leaders that they've had.


I do not intentionally try to correct you; however, you do seem to leave yourself exposed and vulnerable when you add to this forum, so I will continue…

Yes, leaders are born, and then they are molded along the way, they are not just a mere coincidence from your grand experience at attending some NCOES. One day, when you leave the service, unless that has already happened, you will find that out.

Just because someone, somewhere in the past goofed and sent you to a board, and you were able to memorize the same crap that a monkey can memorize, it doesn’t make you leader. You are simply another number who got lucky. It didn’t happen because you were a leader in the waiting.

Now of course the truth hurts, so I am sure you will disagree with me, but the mere fact is that there are folks like you who wish to hide behind whatever rank the military ever promoted you to. There are Privates in the military that have more leadership skills than some of the CSM’s I have worked with.

Is that their fault that they were brainwashed and tricked into thinking they were ever worth the same trailer trash mentality they were born with, or is it my fault that I was reared, led, and trained from birth to be a leader?

Lets start another forum in here called McGyver is right no matter what, or he will continue to fill the void in this forum by insinuating that his vast experience at being a leader is in fact the be, know and do that the military has been preaching about.
In other words, go find a group of Soldiers that might listen to your horse sh@t. Because that is all that you are try to pass off as experience.

You may now continue forward, and have a great day… CARRY ON! :tongue:

[MCGYVER]

Carrion, I honestly wouldn't expect someone of your limited intellect, ability and experience to understand. When dealing with you the old adage about challenging an unarmed man to a battle of the wits comes to mind. I picture you as one of the fresh recruits from my past that I had to "mold" into a man. Some day you'll be a man but until then just enjoy your youth cupcake.

Lead from the front! S.A.M.C.

[CarryOn]

Carrion, I honestly wouldn't expect someone of your limited intellect, ability and experience to understand. When dealing with you the old adage about challenging an unarmed man to a battle of the wits comes to mind. I picture you as one of the fresh recruits from my past that I had to "mold" into a man. Some day you'll be a man but until then just enjoy your youth cupcake.

Lead from the front! S.A.M.C.

Considering that I am finishing up a masters degree and you are still trying to figure out how to use your G.E.D., I would not try to involve myself with your wits. As you stated perfectly; I cannot compete with someone who has no wits. As both your ignorance and ill-experience in anything military has already been exposed, I will cease from replying to your 3rd grade comments.

Once you have decided to serve your country at all, and join the service at all, then you may once again try to challenge me, until you at least leave your mommy's house, please try to not embarrass yourself anymore, and keep your hole shut. You first have to be a Soldier to compete with one.

As far as being a cupcake... this comment almost sounds like you are a homo. This is the second time you have referred to me as a cupcake. Now although being a homo is alright, as long as you don't tell me outright, please keep your homo tendencies to yourself. FAG!

Now, with your mom by your side, and still wondering what you should do with your G.E.D. and your closet homo habits, you may CARRY ON!

Last thing... stop pretending to be anything but an unemployed, zero military experience, still living with your mommy, needing your ass kicked, hiding in the closet homo.

Bye bye now... flamer

That will be all.

[MCGYVER]

This from a guy that couldn't spell imbecile? Masters degree huh? Yeah, okay. Have a nice day cupcake. btw, you are a cupcake because you sound/act like a little girl. aka, my biotch. Have a problem with that, do something about it. I'm here at Fort Hood. All day, every day.

[CarryOn]

This from a guy that couldn't spell imbecile? Masters degree huh? Yeah, okay. Have a nice day cupcake. btw, you are a cupcake because you sound/act like a little girl. aka, my biotch. Have a problem with that, do something about it. I'm here at Fort Hood. All day, every day.

Little man (AKA McGyver); because you are at Fort Hood doesn't mean anything to me. You are like the rest of the folks that I have come across in my career. Little with mind and little with thought.

When you decide you can handle anything besides third grade threats... try joining the military and become something besides a verbal thug.

I have combat boots that are scarier than your weak threats. How low of an IQ you must have to try elementary school comments.

To think that by not knowing how to respond to a Soldiers question, it came to you being a thug in this forum. Again… you should have your Privates proof read your responses before posting them. At least you would have an excuse and could blame someone for your ill thought of responses.

Good day now and keep changing your diapers.

Now carry on!
:cool:

[MCGYVER]

carrion, I didn't threaten you at all. I do understand how you would "feel" threatened though. It happens when kids talk to adults sometimes. I'm simply telling you where I am so If you want to look me up some time you know where to go. Hell, I might even buy you an ice cream some time cupcake. You can go back to playing your games now. Grown folk are talking here. Your drivel (yep, another word you'll have to look up) is as weak as you are. It's actually funny reading your stuff. Do your parents know that you are posting on this website?

[CarryOn]

carrion, I didn't threaten you at all. I do understand how you would "feel" threatened though. It happens when kids talk to adults sometimes. I'm simply telling you where I am so If you want to look me up some time you know where to go. Hell, I might even buy you an ice cream some time cupcake. You can go back to playing your games now. Grown folk are talking here. Your drivel (yep, another word you'll have to look up) is as weak as you are. It's actually funny reading your stuff. Do your parents know that you are posting on this website?

I like your attitude, and I think you and I would make an astounding NCO team, although you and I do not agree on each topic, we neither one are willing to give up. You seem to have a go fuck yourself approach to things, like I do. Two hard heads butting against the other.

Keep the crazy folks from shooting the others down there in Texas, and until our next debate... carry on.

[CarryOn]

I like your attitude, and I think you and I would make an astounding NCO team, although you and I do not agree on each topic, we neither one are willing to give up. You seem to have a go fuck yourself approach to things, like I do. Two hard heads butting against the other.

Keep the crazy folks from shooting the others down there in Texas, and until our next debate... carry on.

One last thing Mcgyver... I am your boss, you just don't know it yet. That's right... no matter what your comment is, you still are the lesser..........................................

Carry On!

[MCGYVER]

Okay, we'll agree to disagree on some of the subleties. I agree that we both seem hard-headed, headstrong, stubborn, etc. I'm a jerk and a sarcastic asshole but I'm okay with that.

[TS32667]

Unfortunately I have seen such an occurence. However I have also been around long enough to reap the benefits of a Soldier attending the Soldier of the Month board. The SOM board can be a conduit for developing a SM and instilling a drive to excel and emulate Leadership attributes he or she has studied about.

[US = Progress vs Congress]

Little man (AKA McGyver); because you are at Fort Hood doesn't mean anything to me. You are like the rest of the folks that I have come across in my career. Little with mind and little with thought.

When you decide you can handle anything besides third grade threats... try joining the military and become something besides a verbal thug.

I have combat boots that are scarier than your weak threats. How low of an IQ you must have to try elementary school comments.

To think that by not knowing how to respond to a Soldiers question, it came to you being a thug in this forum. Again… you should have your Privates proof read your responses before posting them. At least you would have an excuse and could blame someone for your ill thought of responses.

Good day now and keep changing your diapers.

Now carry on!
:cool:

The World Wide Web - providing a forum for service members to loudly proclaim their ignorance to the world for over 15 years.

[CHIEFORDNANCE]

Just bomb the board and give them the wrong answers, better yet show up in your ACUs, the Army is an Institution and they LOVE ROBOTS hence the replies to screw a soldier.

Chiefordnance

[CHIEFORDNANCE]

Just bomb the board and give them the wrong answers, better yet show up in your ACUs, the ARMY is an Institution and they LOVE ROBOTS hence the replies to screw a soldier.

Chiefordnance

[JP2153]

Every Service member that is eligible for promotion REGARDLESS of how much time they have left should be afforded that chance. When the individual goes into the Civilian sector that experience carries over when he interviews for a job.

[CHCKNHAWK]

The easy answer is yes, but that doesn't mean the Army can force a Soldier to do well! As a senior NCO, I've always resisted any push to force Soldiers to a board. Let the good leaders and those with motivation and drive get promoted ahead of the lazy ones.

[VOA]

I agree. If a soldier doesn't want to go to the board, don't send them! Why push a soldier who doesn't want to lead in front of one who does? Even if the guy who does is a mouth breather, at least he wants to give it a shot and deserves the chance.

[INGUARD]

I agree. If a soldier doesn't want to go to the board, don't send them! Why push a soldier who doesn't want to lead in front of one who does? Even if the guy who does is a mouth breather, at least he wants to give it a shot and deserves the chance.

Roger on that. Just make sure everything is documented in their counselings. Especially in the promotion counseling. Just annotate that the soldier denied and have him sign it. If that is how they want to deal with their career then so be it. Work with the soldier that wants to lead and fast track.

[CSMPKING]

Why look at this in a negative way? Look at it as your leadership preparing you for continued service for the next four to six years. Who does not want to get a pay raise? It is the responsibility of your chain of command to train and prepare you for the next higher grade. Being on the promotion standing list is something less you will need to accomplish. Too many times I have seen Soldiers using the excuse of "I am not ready" because they are scared to go before a board. All Soldiers need to be encouraged to do better for themselves. If you decide to leave the service, then you will have on your resume that you were being considered for promotion and employers see that as a plus. If you stay and PCS to another unit, your leadership should place you in a job sutibale to your leadership potential and continue to train and support you so that you will be a successful NCO.

[INGUARD]

LOL today my supervisor said I'm going to the Soldier of the month board next month. I said no I'm not, I don't wanna do that. He jokes and stuff but I hope he's not serious cause I'm not doing all that stuff. There are other people in the office that he can choose.

Its your career. If someone offers to go to the board. Do it!!!