In regards to Devil Dog

[CommunityEditor]

Listen up, Devil Dogs. Oh yeah, that got your attention. Perhaps it even got your blood boiling? Or maybe you didn’t notice the big double-D.

Lately, reactions to the Corps’ longtime nickname generally depend on the age of the Marine listening.

A generational divide is opening around the term “Devil Dog,” which came into use 90 years ago on the battlefields of France. While it’s been a term of colloquial endearment for generations of leathernecks, some of the newest and youngest Marines say they’re tired of being called Devil Dogs. They even take offense at the term.

That came as a surprise to former Staff Sgt. Glenn Kirst, a 34-year-old financial advisor in Milwaukee who joined the Corps in 1991 and spent 10 years on active duty. He was out shopping with his girlfriend a few weeks ago when the pair passed a Marine in the parking lot of a Best Buy store.

Kirst grinned and nodded at the Marine, sporting a “USMC” T-shirt and close-cropped hair as he walked with a girlfriend.

“I said ‘Hey, there’s another Devil Dog,’” Kirst recalled. The Marine gave him a blank stare and the Marine’s girlfriend got angry. “She started shouting at me. ‘Before you make a comment like that, why don’t you grow some f---ing balls and serve your country.’”

“I was stunned,” Kirst said. “I called my friend, who is a Marine captain in the infantry. He told me the term ‘Devil Dog’ is not used much anymore, and is usually used in a negative manner. I couldn’t believe what I was hearing.

“When I was in the Corps, I used the nickname Devil Dog like a badge of honor.”

Cultural shift?
Devil Dog has been a favorite Marine expression since the bloody Battle of Belleau Wood, a ferocious World War I engagement near Paris that also left the Corps with two of its most endearing quotes. “Retreat? Hell, we just got here,” exclaimed Capt. Lloyd W. Williams, as the French fell back. Similarly, then-Gunnery Sgt. Dan Daly refused to let his men give up, shouting his motivating “Come on, you sons of bitches, do you want to live forever?”

As legend has it, this determination to win led one German prisoner to tell his captors the Marines reminded him of “Teufelshunde,” a German term translated as “devil dogs.”

The Corps ran with it, using the term in a popular recruiting poster that pitted a big Marine bulldog against a tiny German dachshund, the weenie dog fleeing with his tail between his legs.

The strange — and seemingly sudden — shift in the meaning of the term has many Marines confounded.

“Just try dropping the compliment ‘Devil Dog’ on anyone of any rank above [lance corporal.] You will get the stink eye of death. Just how this honorable moniker became derogatory, I have no idea,” wrote “Blogger X,” the pen name for a blog writer on the Marine Corps Reserve Web site, in February.

His post drew some speculation from other Marines.

“I think the backlash against ‘Devil Dog’ does begin with the leadership. [Noncommissioned officers] (myself included) use the following phrase, ‘HEY, DEVIL DOG!’ to initiate a ‘correction’ when we don’t know exactly who the Marine may be. Thusly, hearing the phrase Devil Dog creates a negative Pavlovian response in Marines. As they come up in the Corps, the response stays,” one Marine wrote.

“We may be proud of the name, but nowadays it does carry a connotation of condescension.”

One Marine major agreed that the new negative connotation stems from discipline. “It’s a preface to getting your ass chewed,” he said.

Sgt. Maj. John Estrada, who served as the Corps’ top enlisted Marine until his retirement last year, agreed that the term Devil Dog is “evolving.”

“I don’t think it resonates well with today’s young Marines. Some folks had issues with it,” Estrada said in a recent interview. “The young Marines did not understand the tradition and history of the term ‘Devil Dog,’ and they just reacted to it differently. The Marines you have to today, it’s just a different generation and maybe they don’t look at the term being used the same way.”

Love it or hate it
A quiet debate about the connotations of Devil Dog is underway on Wikipedia, a popular — but not always factual — online encyclopedia where anyone can log in and edit individual articles. The entry for Devil Dog has changed frequently in recent months. Earlier this year, the entry explicitly said: “To call a U.S. Marine a ‘Devil Dog’ is considered derogatory.”

“It is considered a diminutive, and is considered mildly insulting when used by a peer or slightly senior Marine. Its use is most common at the Marine Corps [School of Infantry], where it is the standard term of address for students.”

That was changed, however, by an anonymous editor a few weeks ago. On March 16, the Devil Dog article was revised to say that the term “was once” considered derogatory, but “now it is far more acceptable.”

To be sure, the term is not completely lost. The Corps still sanctions its use in many ways. There’s Camp Devil Dog at the School of Infantry-East near Camp Lejeune, N.C. Marines in California host a race dubbed the “Devil Dog Duathalon.” The Military Order of the Devil Dogs is celebrating 75 years.

Eric Reust, a former Marine who runs the Odyssey Tattoo shop in Jacksonville, N.C., said he’s still inking more than 100 Devil Dog images a year with no noticeable decline. “Marines are still comin’ in, ooh-rah, and they get the globe and anchor or a devil dog,” Reust said.

Charles Melson, the Marine Corps’ chief historian, said he was unaware of any new negative connotation to Devil Dog.

“It’s situational,” Melson said. “If the first sergeant says ‘Hey, Devil Dog,’ then it’s the same thing as saying ‘Hey, slick.’ But if it’s between Marines of equal rank, it doesn’t have the same meaning.

“To me, Devil Dog would refer to a ferocious nature, a fighter, someone who would never give up.”

Instead, the phrase is often used to replace “hey, stupid” or worse. It’s not the first time in recent years that junior service members began taking offense at a generic term typically used in disciplinary settings.

The Navy has had a similar problem with the term “shipmate.” Once a generic term for a fellow sailor, it is now perceived by many to be derogatory. That stems from some chiefs using it during corrections, “Get that rack squared away, shipmate!” or “What the hell did you just say to me, shipmate?” The junior enlisted sailors in turn use “shipmate” sarcastically with their peers.

Last year, senior Navy officials grew concerned about the evolving use of the term “shipmate” and laid plans to reclaim it for general use. In October, they announced an essay-writing contest on the topic, “What being a shipmate means to me.”

A goal for the contest is to “remove the negative stigma,” said Command Master Chief Tom Howard, Pacific Fleet’s top enlisted sailor, in a prepared statement.

Evolution, not revolution
Maybe the waning popularity of Devil Dog reflects how distant the World War I story may seem to junior Marines. Recruiters often note that today’s junior Marines are as removed from WWI as the so-called “Greatest Generation” was from the American Civil War.

“A lot of them don’t know their history,” Melson said.

Perhaps Devil Dog is, in some ways, politically incorrect. Resistance to it may stem from a “growing sensitivity about the use of pejorative terms,” said Mady Segal, a military sociologist at the University of Maryland.

Words come and go. Estrada pointed to the phrase “gung ho,” popularized during World War II by a Marine officer who worked with the Chinese Army.

The original meaning was “to work together.” But over the years, it took on an ironic connotation, suggesting excessive enthusiasm or overzealousness. Now, it’s rarely used by Marines at all.

“Devil Dog, I think, that’s kind of fading away also.” Estrada said. “This is all part of an evolution. Look at how our leaders are today. It used to be that you’d be scared to go see your first sergeant or your sergeant major. Today, leaders are more open-minded, more approachable. The leadership had to adjust.

“In order to be effective leaders, you have to adjust to your audience, use different techniques in order to reach them and lead them properly.”

However, Estrada added, “We need to be careful and don’t get away from our history.”

History’s not always junior Marines’ top focus, and sometimes they just get tired of feeling like some boot who just arrived at the recruit depot. To those Marines, “Devil Dog” doesn’t evoke a storied battle on the Western Front so much as a stern NCO.

“Usually when it’s coming from them, it’s because you did something wrong,” said one lance corporal based at Camp Lejeune. “We prefer to be called by our ranks.”


Article: http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/news/2008/04/marine_devildog_042708w/

[KnoxRJ]

I agree with this 100%. I have had to talk to more than a couple of young Marines whom I have heard say "I just got Devil Dogged by..." and I had to teach them that Devil Dog is not a derogatory name but is does not help in the instance in which a senior enlisted Marine forbade the term to be used in her Company. Our pride, personal respect and ownership of being a Marine is truely taking a beating these days.

[USMCGRIZZ]

No Devil Dog..no Tattoos..pretty soon we will be polished enough to pass for Air Force. Lets hear it for politicall-correct leadership! I DO NOT agree with Marines using a honorable term such as Devil Dog to disrespect junior Marines. They are the ones responsilble for the demise of "esprit de corps" by destroying our beloved traditions. When I was in you just said "Marine" if you wanted to get their attention....or you called them by rank or rank and name. How difficult is that?

[AH/U1HMECH]

USMCGRIZZ just hit it right on the head.The Marines nowadays dont understand what its all about. 99% think its a joke and think they are all back on the block. Why should I conform to them, they joined the Marine Corps, the Corps didnt join them.

[SGT6124]

Hell i'll admit it, about six years ago it was cool to be called a devil dog, it put goosebumps on the back of your neck. Now, it's just plainly abused. Mainly to posers or those who want to fit in by using it out of it's intended context. I however prefer Marine when they are jacked up, and devil dog when they did something great. We must teach these juniors the correct usage and meaning of the phrase. I personally hate to be double d'd for no reason. I have heard it alot from SgtMajors and below, but some people wonder why it spreads like a wildfire.

[Mateo820506]

It is a changing Marine Corps. We are allowing more disrespect. We are not holding our traditions very highly but adapting to the new world political and not so political viewpoints. I don't think we are adapting for the better. We are losing those traditions that make us Devil Dogs.

[MACHINE666]

No Devil Dog..no Tattoos..pretty soon we will be polished enough to pass for Air Force. Lets hear it for politicall-correct leadership! I DO NOT agree with Marines using a honorable term such as Devil Dog to disrespect junior Marines. They are the ones responsilble for the demise of "esprit de corps" by destroying our beloved traditions. When I was in you just said "Marine" if you wanted to get their attention....or you called them by rank or rank and name. How difficult is that?

Get used to it Marines! I hate to say it, but as much fun as you poke at us Air Force weenies for being squeaky-clean and P.C., you guys were bound to catch some static sooner or later! Do I think it's ridiculous? Without a doubt! You guys are killers not Boy Scouts! If I had the right to be called "ein Teufel Hund" I too would naturally take offense if someone (especially a fellow Marine) tried correcting me. I hate to say it, but as much as I am in agreement with the majority of the people here, the 21st Century will herald the sensitive, caring military professional, required to help with bake sales and car washes while killing the enemy with kindness. Harsh language and any kind of remotely aggressive posturing/image will become strictly taboo, as the American public will continue to lose touch with reality and demand to be handled with kid gloves 24/7. Mark my words kids, we're the Roman Empire re-incarnated but in the worst possible way.

[Sgt_Mort1984]

My first experience being called a Devil Dog was by my Sergeant Major in Okinawa. I was walking on the grass and my Sergeant Major corrected me with a stern "Devil Dog, get off my grass". I bear no hard feelings to being a Devil Dog, that is the hertiage that I chose to have. Those that joined the Marine Corps chose to be Devil Dogs, Shocktroops, Warriors, Hard Chargers, Leathernecks, and Jarheads. The issue with being called a Devil Dog must not be a recent one, as many Staff NCO's and NCO's are the ones that are using the term in a derogitory manner. Is being called Devil Dog any different that being called a boot? Even the Marine Corps Times lists the new boot camp graduates as boots. Is that going to change as well?

[Proud Mom]

Ok, jumping in and will probably get sent to the corner as I was not active duty, just a dependent spouse.

My Daddy was an Army DI and the man I claim as my passion in life was a Marine. Being proud of the military was drummed in and it stuck. Maybe it's my age but to me calling him Devil Dog is an honor not a derogatory remark. Teach the younger generation the proud history of the Corps. Stop using it to chastise. Use it in the vein it was meant...to show pride, valor and tenacity. If the proud term Devil Dog is washed away into history, what's next..Ooo-rah??

[Lcpl1371]

From the perspective of a junior ranking Marine, it isn't that we're ignorant of our history or that we just don't care anymore- far from it. But these days, beginning with our first day at SOI/MCT, Devil Dog is used far too often as an extremely condescending way to address new/junior Marines, and most often when we f-ed up and need correction. I can't even remember the last time I got double D'd for doing something positive. I completely agree with SgtMort that today, it's an issue of NCO's and SNCO's abusing Devil Dog's usage and proud history by using it in a derogatory manner towards lesser-ranking Marines. Junior Marines have just as much pride in our history as our senior Marines do- but to our newest generation of Marines, hearing "Hey, Devil Dog..." from a senior Marine has become the equivalent of "Hey, boot..." or "Hey, idiot..." which is really sad.

[rideyz]

Right there is the problem. When using the term "Devil Dog" it is in automatic responce to a Junior Marine. If a Marine of lesser grade referes to a higher grade as a "Devil Dog" then that Marine is wrong. It's like a hidden rule not to call senior enlisted or officers "Devil Dog". When the name came about it was given to Marines not Junior Marines but all Marines. Rideyz

[Gunny_2862]

Let me follow up on your point rideyz....if you know that Marine is senior rank, it is within the proper customs and courtesies to call him by his/her rank (name is optional). You don't address a senior by anything else....ever. It's not that we frown on being called devil dog....it's that you are not giving me the proper courtesy. I've graduated past SSgt's and below calling me Marine, DD, and leatherneck to get my attention, if you know who I am, you know what to do or you will find out the hard way.

If any Marine is out and about and I want their attention (good or bad has nothing to do with it) I will say hey devil dog (or hey Marine, it just depends on what comes out first) to get their attention due to me not knowing who there are or what their rank is. If they can answer my question or I've already corrected them, so be it, move on. If I need to get closer to them to address the issue (again, good or bad) then when I see their rank, I'll address them as such.

This whole devil dog BS has gotten worse over the years because people assume its deragatory use. It's a way to get someones attention who you do not immediately recognize. If you happen to be a hard-charger who is constantly showing his ass in public and getting called DD all the time, how about doing the right thing or carring a big white sign with black letters that shows everybody from 100 yards your rank and name? Again, don't be pissed at the moniker, fix what you were doing to get corrected and maybe you'll only hear the term "devil dog" in a good manner. Just a suggesstion to all.....

[TJMAC77SP]

Wow, this one took me by surprise. Admittedly I spent my years in the Air Force but my opinion and observation has always been that the term Devil Dog was said and received with pride. In fact, so much so that I would hesitate to use it when addressing a Marine lest I am mistaken for a poser. I assume the history of the term is taught during Marine Boot so that every Marine knows the term was earned in the most honored way, given as a sign of respect by the enemy.

I know times change and I am beginning to sound like all the retirees I met during my career but…………what the hell is happening to us ?!?!?!?

[JusWordz]

As A Junior Active Duty Marine I can honestly say I had enjoyed being called "Devil Dog" until I hit the fleet. Once I checked into my parent command I noticed Sgt;s and above only use the term when speaking negative to another Marine. I never hear " hey good job Devil Dog" . Its always "wtf devil dog" or "or something else to humiliate the junior Marine. The sad part is it has never happened to me but I watch it happen to the Marines around me and it breaks the spirits of once happy ready to re-enlist Marines to junior Marines who want to get out as soon as they can..Right now Sgt's and Cpl's are the main reason why Marines are not re-enlisting no one wants to hear "hey devil dog" anymore because it is almost always followed by something negative.

[SGT6124]

Right now Sgt's and Cpl's are the main reason why Marines are not re-enlisting.
Your kidding right? You must be. I have never heard that from and Marine in my entire career. It's always because the Marine corps is getting soft, or it's changing for the worst, but yet it's the Sgt's and Cpl's that are letting the troops get away with murder.

[MRCORPORAL]

I agree, most of the time SNCOs use the term double DDs when talking to junior Marines. They say it like "Hey sh** bag..or hey stupid. Rarely do I see higher ups use the term in a positive way. I honestly don't like being called "Devil Dog".

[marinegrunt0311]

there is nothing wrong with being called devil dog. i've been in 2 years so im still pretty new to the corps even though i have a combat deployment under my belt. we were givin the name for being fierce fighters. the name can be used as a precourser to but also as a complement. anybody who thinks otherwise must not know how the name was earned or arent one of the few and proud hard chargers

[HawaiiMarine_guest]

Hearing it every time doesn't make me upset. You can usually tell if it's being used as a derogatory term based on how the person is saying it (the tone of his or her voice and the situation). I think it's pretty clear to tell a difference between a compliment and the beginning of an ass chewing. I'm sure the article itself will make people more aware of how this term should be used. If all you junior Marines don't like being "Devildogged," then it's up to you guys to not use it in a derogatory way when you become NCO's and talk to your subordinates. It takes time, this article won't change the Marine Corps in one week. it may not change at all, it's just up to how many Marines are willing to change how they talk to other Marines. If I want to get the attention of a subordinate Marine, I simply address that Marine by rank. This is how I was taught in Cpl's Course and I'm sure it's taught in other PME Courses as well.

[DIAZJJ]

I honestly belive there is nothing wrong with the term "Devil Dog" in any way a Marine decides to use it. The problem I see is that those Junior Marines were soft before the Marine Corps, pretend to act hard during bootcamp and when they get to the fleet they get soft. Grow the f^ck up, get thicker skin and march on! You asked to join the Marines, not the other way around. We want a few proud men and women not delicate mommas boys and girls, if this was the case join the Boy/Girl Scouts!

[MACK0811]

Civilians who were never in the Corps trying to be hip by calling me "Devil Dog" - Gay

Seniors calling me "Devil Dog" - Hasn't happened to me in years

Seniors back in the day calling me "Devil Dog" because they would catch me screwing around and didn't know who I was - AWESOME, because then they would correct me on the spot and not even bother to remember my name or ask what unit I was with (most of the time).

Saying "Devil Dog" is all about circumstance and tone of voice. If you're screwing up/goofing off then hearing "Devil Dog" means you're busted. If you're doing a good job then hearing "Devil Dog" means the guy talking to you doesn't know your name (or forgot your name) but wants to acknowledge you're doing the right thing or a good job.

Now get over it you Boot Devil Dogs.

[SGT_C!]

I agree that the term has been used as a attention getter prior to be corrected, but when did the Corps become so damn soft? Recently I was told that yelling at another Marine is not real leadership...HUH? Our traditions show the world that we are THE elite fighting force of the world, when stuff hits the fan, we push even harder, but that's combat not garison (so I assumed). Regardless, being called Devil dog is being called a Marine, period. If junior Marines snivels and whines because they got "double-D'd", maybe they need to look in the mirror and see if they even rate to be called a devil dog. Maybe a "---- bird" is the term we should evolve to (add whatever you wish to before bird). It seems that being "MOTO" has turned into a "4-letter word", like it's wrong to be that way. Junior Marines have become so civilianized that being in the Corps has become just another 9 to 5 job. This isn't a Union, this is the Marine Corps! And our job as leaders is to keep those traditions alive with our Marines. KILL! (or is that politically incorrect too?)

[Sgt_Mort1984]

The sad part is it has never happened to me but I watch it happen to the Marines around me and it breaks the spirits of once happy ready to re-enlist Marines to junior Marines who want to get out as soon as they can..Right now Sgt's and Cpl's are the main reason why Marines are not re-enlisting no one wants to hear "hey devil dog" anymore because it is almost always followed by something negative.


First, I'm half way through my second enlistment and my Sgt's were one of the reasons I re-enlisted (the 60k bonus didn't hurt) - though I know each case is different, if a Sgt or Cpl is the reason that Marines are not re-enlisting, then those Marines are extremely short sighted. It maybe a small Marine Corps but the likely hood of working with those NCO's again when you can PCA/PCS to a different unit or location is small. I've been with 4 different units, and I've only worked with 1 Marine at two different units, because we were good friends and CHOSE to go to the same unit! From talking to friends that are Career Planners - retention doesn't seem to be a problem at all, especailly with all the money that their throwing at Marines to re-enlist. As for Sgt's and Cpl's Devil Dogging Marines - they learned it from some one, and those people learned it from some one else.

[RunToGround]

"You don't like being called a Devil Dog?" It's OK if it's used in a positive way, but not OK if you are being dressed down....???? "Waaaaaaaaa...." Read your history on how Marines EARNED that moniker."Suck it up!"

[MACK0811]

I haven't been called "Devil Dog" in a while. Lately, everybody has just been calling me "Tool". Is that better or worse than "Devil Dog"?

[PJYoung]

First off, the girl from the story who yelled at the former SSgt was just expressing the feelings of her boyfriend who has obviously been DDed a lot. She was clueless and not worth wasting any more breath over.

I got a great idea for those who don't like being Devil Dogged. Stop doing stuff wrong.

Maybe it is time to retire Devil Dog and use something like "You wonderful human being"
It could go like this:
" You wonderful human being, I know you didn't mean to set foot on this grass that belongs to the United States Government, but as the senior enlisted Marine on this base I would appreciate it if you used the side walk or other approved walking area. Please have a pleasent afternoon"
It just don't have the same ring to it though

[MACK0811]

I make it a point to walk on the grass whenever I can. God made the grass. It grows back all the time. And since "blood makes the grass grow and 'Devil Dogs' make that blood flow" I don't see why seniors with nothing better to do should be "Devil Dogging" guys about walking on it.

[RETSGTMAJ]

Just another piece of our history and tradition going down the shitter. I suppose next we will be on a first name basis. Sure can't piss off our new young Marines now can we.

[Sgt_Mort1984]

First off, the girl from the story who yelled at the former SSgt was just expressing the feelings of her boyfriend who has obviously been DDed a lot. She was clueless and not worth wasting any more breath over.

I got a great idea for those who don't like being Devil Dogged. Stop doing stuff wrong.

Maybe it is time to retire Devil Dog and use something like "You wonderful human being"
It could go like this:
" You wonderful human being, I know you didn't mean to set foot on this grass that belongs to the United States Government, but as the senior enlisted Marine on this base I would appreciate it if you used the side walk or other approved walking area. Please have a pleasent afternoon"
It just don't have the same ring to it though

That gave me a laugh, I definatly think that the "You wonderful human being" will work just fine....sure we may get laughed at by every other service, but its all good right..? Everyone seems to be saying the same thing through out these posts - that if you don't like being called a Devil Dog - then don't screw up! I've been called a lot worse than a Devil Dog...... Being called a Sarge is definatly worse than being called a Devil Dog. ( Not to offend any Army Sergeants) but I'm a Sergeant, not a Sarge.

[MACK0811]

Final word on "Devil Dog": http://www.spike.com/video/marines/2690790

[fmrldylthrnk]

Final word on "Devil Dog": http://www.spike.com/video/marines/2690790

ROFL! I've seen this like 6 times and it cracks me up every time!

[RunToGround]

Nice Bio flick MACK0811! Dating your sister is not acceptable, though that right hook of her's was pretty good. Looks like you prefer the grass on the other side of the fence as well as walking on it.
Tsk,tsk...
Semper Fi

[phrogg_mech1]

It's been a common trend that junior Marines have/had lost the sense of motovation. I've seen Marines come and go in my career, but not one has ever complained about being called "Devil Dog". A good friend of mine showed me the article a couple of days ago, as he was telling me about what he read, my face dropped. I said "that's what happens when spoiled brats join our Corps". People join for the wrong reasons. Now a days the youth today have no respect. How can a Marine barely going through boot camp, MCT/SOI, the FLEET so and so forth have the disrespect to a senior SNCO or even a field grade Officer or anyone! Look honestly like i tell my "Devil Dogs" don't take to heart, you have got to have thick skin. Take it for what it's worth, whether you're getting your ass chewed or even greeted by a higher rank Enlisted or Officer. Anyway, i think I'd rather be called "Devil Dog" rather than a "Tool", "Boot", "Nugget", "Shitbird" etc, etc, etc.

[BLANK]

I personally do not like being called a Devil Dog. One, I didn't serve in Europe when it happened so I don't feel like I should be called that and two I don't want someone to call me a Devil. Overall, I feel like the term is something that should be done away with. But with higher ranking individuals still remembering the old times it will probably be another millenium before it does dissappear.

[TJMAC77SP]

That gave me a laugh, I definatly think that the "You wonderful human being" will work just fine....sure we may get laughed at by every other service, but its all good right..? Everyone seems to be saying the same thing through out these posts - that if you don't like being called a Devil Dog - then don't screw up! I've been called a lot worse than a Devil Dog...... Being called a Sarge is definatly worse than being called a Devil Dog. ( Not to offend any Army Sergeants) but I'm a Sergeant, not a Sarge.

You do NOT want to call an army sergeant 'Sarge' although they do have a very unique way of pronouncing Sergeant. Unfortunately the term is used in the AF too much for my taste and addressing an NCO as ‘Sir’ is actually taught during basic.

[Proud Mom]

ROFL! I've seen this like 6 times and it cracks me up every time!

ooor-rah LOL that was hilarious and I will be passing that url around to my military friends

Thank you for the laugh!

[MacMan]

This is simple. Each and everyone who has earned the title Marine has also earned the title Devil Dog. They are interchangeable. If you take offense to a name or title, especially one with such a rich and proud tradition, you need to take the preverbal look in the mirror. Traditions, customs and courtesies are what make the Marine Corps the Marine Corps. Marine, Devil Dog, Teufelshunde, Warrior, and even Jarhead (when used by fellow Marines) are enduring terms and at times not so enduring terms. But no matter the use, the titles are a badge of honor, even when used to correct fellow Marines, Devil Dogs, Teufelshunde, Warriors, or Jarheads.

[Gunny_2862]

I personally do not like being called a Devil Dog. One, I didn't serve in Europe when it happened so I don't feel like I should be called that and two I don't want someone to call me a Devil. Overall, I feel like the term is something that should be done away with. But with higher ranking individuals still remembering the old times it will probably be another millenium before it does dissappear.

Well the Marines currently serving in the 5th and 6th Marine Regiments that wear the French Fourragere weren't in Europe duirng WWI as well, but you're not proposing we strip that award from them too are you?

Just because YOU don't personally like something doesn't mean tradition and history should take a backseat. We've already lost alot of the lingo we as Marines used to speak when I came in. I correct Marines all the time for saying they're going to the bathroom or going to mop the floor. It's HEAD and SWAB the DECK!!

If you didn't know we were called devil dogs when you signed that paper weight you call a contract, shame on you for not researching what you were signing up for. Now get back to work devil dog and stop irking us Marines that do have a sense of pride and tradition and would like to keep it.

[fmrldylthrnk]

Well the Marines currently serving in the 5th and 6th Marine Regiments that wear the French Fourragere weren't in Europe duirng WWI as well, but you're not proposing we strip that award from them too are you?

Just because YOU don't personally like something doesn't mean tradition and history should take a backseat. We've already lost alot of the lingo we as Marines used to speak when I came in. I correct Marines all the time for saying they're going to the bathroom or going to mop the floor. It's HEAD and SWAB the DECK!!

If you didn't know we were called devil dogs when you signed that paper weight you call a contract, shame on you for not researching what you were signing up for. Now get back to work devil dog and stop irking us Marines that do have a sense of pride and tradition and would like to keep it.

ooh-freakin-rah.

(and yut, yut, semper fi)

I remember being so crushed whilst in boot camp and the DI referred to my gear as "trash". LOL!

[Salieri]

USMCGRIZZ just hit it right on the head.The Marines nowadays dont understand what its all about. 99% think its a joke and think they are all back on the block. Why should I conform to them, they joined the Marine Corps, the Corps didnt join them.
You missed the point of the editorial, and are too eager to blame the new Marines coming in. "Devil dog" is looked at not as a badge of honor to them but a negatory term, like a sh--bird or someone who screws up, because it so commonly is used in that negative manner. As opposed to reward a Marine for doing good. Its synonymous now with "someone who screws up" than "Devil Dog" itself. And what does them may or may not thinking they're "back on the block" have to do with this? It's a logical fallacy you've stated with no correlation to why many Marines think negatively of the term "devil dog" - because it's so commonly used in a negative way.

[Salieri]

Hell i'll admit it, about six years ago it was cool to be called a devil dog, it put goosebumps on the back of your neck. Now, it's just plainly abused. Mainly to posers or those who want to fit in by using it out of it's intended context. I however prefer Marine when they are jacked up, and devil dog when they did something great. We must teach these juniors the correct usage and meaning of the phrase. I personally hate to be double d'd for no reason. I have heard it alot from SgtMajors and below, but some people wonder why it spreads like a wildfire.

Well-said.
*thumbs up*

[AH/U1HMECH]

No, I think I do understand. I can call him/her Devil Dog, or Marine, if he/she screwed up or not. Im not going to walk up to this Marine and study their name tapes then address them, good or bad. If they werent screwed up, then maybe, just maybe they wouldnt perceive it as derogatory.

[Salieri]

Let me follow up on your point rideyz....if you know that Marine is senior rank, it is within the proper customs and courtesies to call him by his/her rank (name is optional). You don't address a senior by anything else....ever. It's not that we frown on being called devil dog....it's that you are not giving me the proper courtesy. I've graduated past SSgt's and below calling me Marine, DD, and leatherneck to get my attention, if you know who I am, you know what to do or you will find out the hard way.

If any Marine is out and about and I want their attention (good or bad has nothing to do with it) I will say hey devil dog (or hey Marine, it just depends on what comes out first) to get their attention due to me not knowing who there are or what their rank is. If they can answer my question or I've already corrected them, so be it, move on. If I need to get closer to them to address the issue (again, good or bad) then when I see their rank, I'll address them as such.

This whole devil dog BS has gotten worse over the years because people assume its deragatory use. It's a way to get someones attention who you do not immediately recognize. If you happen to be a hard-charger who is constantly showing his ass in public and getting called DD all the time, how about doing the right thing or carring a big white sign with black letters that shows everybody from 100 yards your rank and name? Again, don't be pissed at the moniker, fix what you were doing to get corrected and maybe you'll only hear the term "devil dog" in a good manner. Just a suggesstion to all.....
Perfectly said.
Hopefully someone at MilitaryTimes reads this and includes it in their letters section in the paper.

[Salieri]

As A Junior Active Duty Marine I can honestly say I had enjoyed being called "Devil Dog" until I hit the fleet. Once I checked into my parent command I noticed Sgt;s and above only use the term when speaking negative to another Marine. I never hear " hey good job Devil Dog" . Its always "wtf devil dog" or "or something else to humiliate the junior Marine. The sad part is it has never happened to me but I watch it happen to the Marines around me and it breaks the spirits of once happy ready to re-enlist Marines to junior Marines who want to get out as soon as they can..Right now Sgt's and Cpl's are the main reason why Marines are not re-enlisting no one wants to hear "hey devil dog" anymore because it is almost always followed by something negative.
Prove, or it's not true.

After 4 years you better at least be a Corporal, no matter the MOS. And to say your peers are the reason you don't reenlist, whether it be someone your own rank or one above, is just asinine. You're implying because people are tired of being corrected ("hey devil dog!") they don't want to stay it - but where would you be if you weren't corrected by the Corps? Ever since basic you were corrected, in the fleet you shouldn't have to be corrected, but it happens. As an NCO - after 4 years - you should be correcting others, and do your absolute best in what you do so you won't have to be corrected.

[Salieri]

Your kidding right? You must be. I have never heard that from and Marine in my entire career. It's always because the Marine corps is getting soft, or it's changing for the worst, but yet it's the Sgt's and Cpl's that are letting the troops get away with murder.
It's funny, we hear "the Marine Corps is getting soft". "Kinder, gentler corps". But at no other point in US history has the Marine Corps ever been as efficient as they are now. People should still be corrected. But the "meaner, harder" corps - ie. hazing, beating down new boots, pushing chevrons on - they're not necessary, nor were they ever necessary because it hasn't slowed the corps down one bit in still only getting deadlier and more efficient.

I mean, can you tell me - at what other time in US history has the Marine Corps been as efficient or deadlier than they are now? No where, we're a strictly volunteer, professional fighting force that's only getting better and better with time.

[PFCAcheyIII]

I am a PFC in the USMC and I think it is an honor and privilege to be called "Devil Dog". Ooh Rah

[Cyberuff]

I served 8 years with 2/5 "Yut!" and not a day went by where I heard fellow devil dog's say "Don't Devil Dog ME!" Unfourtanatly these new Marines think it's an insult. While in a leadership role I ALWAYS told my Marines that they can call me a Devil Dog ANYTIME because that is what I am and I take pride in the fact.
I think if you as a Marine are taking offense to being called a Devil Dog then I think YOU joined the wrong gun club. Pretty Soon young Marines will will be offended by "Semper Fi". WAKE UP! This is NOT some weak boy scout club. We are MARINES, We are DEVIL DOGS. Like it or not.

SGT. Justin L. Ruff
United States Marine Corps
"TRUE Devil Dog"

[SGT_C!]

I personally do not like being called a Devil Dog. One, I didn't serve in Europe when it happened so I don't feel like I should be called that and two I don't want someone to call me a Devil. Overall, I feel like the term is something that should be done away with. But with higher ranking individuals still remembering the old times it will probably be another millenium before it does dissappear.

...and now we see the reason why the article was written, exactly what this "BLANK" devil dog wrote. I guess calling you a motivator would just break your heart huh!

[SGT_C!]

Salieri, it's not a matter of how we get the job done now days, the fact of the matter is that young Maines lose their discipline quick, fast and in a hurry. By their 2 year mark, they're ready to drop thier pack and not give a crap anymore. They only claim the title of Marine when it's convienent or benificial to them.

[SGT_C!]

I am a PFC in the USMC and I think it is an honor and privilege to be called "Devil Dog". Ooh Rah

That's what I'm talking about Devil Dog! Stay motivated Warrior! :D

[OLD SCHOOL]

Long ago, when my SDI called me "Devil Dog" for the first time (the morning of graduation), I was very proud. I made it , I am a US MARINE. When does it stop? Are we gong to stop calling one another "Leather Neck" next? Anyone who feels being called "DEVIL DOG" is a slander needs to walk away from our corps. In case some of the people who dislike the moniker Devil dog, go back and read the history of the Marine Corps. Hopefully you can regain a since of respect and pride for how the nick name came to be.


A proud "DEVIL DOG "

[free0352]

I know when I was a PFC in 3/2 back in 1999 being Devil Dogged was always dreaded. "Hey Devil Dog!, Hey Devil Dog" was all we boots ever heard, and when we heard it- all was NOT well. At least we were going to be yelled at and at worst our senior Lcpls would have to hide in a room some where so they could thrash us- because you know- thats not okay in the Corps anymore. Too bad the freaking Army still does that, along with having tattoos... I guess I learned to assosiate the term with pain, hence by my EAS in 2003 the last thing I wanted to hear was those two words. I'm guilty of doing the same stupid thing when I was a Cpl. I guess I didn't get it. It might be a wise idea to stop using the term in a negative light. I certainly don't have the ill physical reaction to "leatherneck" like I did Devil Dog.

[ninjatrainey]

I am a CPL, now going on 5 years. Not once have any of my junior Marines complained about being called "Devil Dog". There is no reason why "Devil Dog" should make Marines throw a hissy fit. It should make our enemies shake in fear.
But if it hurts your feelings, then you can take the time to fill this form out:
http://eatliver.com/i.php?n=2026

Stay Motivated Devil Dogs

[SgtHardCharger]

I got out the Marines in 1997, and I would like to say sorry. The term was never meant to be used that way.

[lcpldontknow]

I’m glad devil dog is dying out. I’ve always been offended when people have called me that, leatherneck, hardcore, hard charger, motivator, stellar, high-speed, or lance criminal. I’ve even been offended when the rank was right, but the inflection was wrong (“Get over here LANCE corporal”). The way the word lance drips of my corporal’s tongue makes me irate. Just because she has 2 months more of time-in-service than me DOESN’T make her better than me. Honestly, I think the Air Force has it right. I don’t usually agree with them, but it’s time we start using first names instead of rank or nicknames. What’s the harm? You don’t have to “devil dog” me to assert your authority. I get the fact you’re pissed off at me merely by your inflection. So, that time my rack wasn’t perfect for field day, Heather’s leadership and power over me would have come across just as clearly if she addressed me by my first name. I say be a leader by your ACTIONS, not how well you can take a term that was once endearing and make it derogatory. A first name Corps is a first rate Corps.

-Brian
Camp Lejeune

[SGT6124]

I’m glad devil dog is dying out. I’ve always been offended when people have called me that, leatherneck, hardcore, hard charger, motivator, stellar, high-speed, or lance criminal. I’ve even been offended when the rank was right, but the inflection was wrong (“Get over here LANCE corporal”). The way the word lance drips of my corporal’s tongue makes me irate. Just because she has 2 months more of time-in-service than me DOESN’T make her better than me. Honestly, I think the Air Force has it right. I don’t usually agree with them, but it’s time we start using first names instead of rank or nicknames. What’s the harm? You don’t have to “devil dog” me to assert your authority. I get the fact you’re pissed off at me merely by your inflection. So, that time my rack wasn’t perfect for field day, Heather’s leadership and power over me would have come across just as clearly if she addressed me by my first name. I say be a leader by your ACTIONS, not how well you can take a term that was once endearing and make it derogatory. A first name Corps is a first rate Corps.

-Brian
Camp Lejeune

HEY MARINE, YOU MUST HAVE LOST YOUR FREAKIN' MIND! This right here shows why your Corporal got promoted and you didn't. Like I tell every marine I have ever seen, YOU are the only one to blame for not being promoted. There are meritorious boards all the time, if you think you can't win them then why the heck are you crying? Get your act togeather and don't ever post another reply in a forum in here saying we should follow the Air Force. THEY FOLLOW US MARINE! Guess what, if your getting devil dogged you are probably either jacked up or deserved it. Get the heck over it.

[cpl usmc]

:mad2:

Can someone please help me understand why Devil Dog is such a "derogatory term"... why because some PFC got their feelings hurt when their NCO called them a Devil Dog... some PFC gets their feelings hurt cause you yell at them, all H**l breaks loose... i have been in the Marine Corps for 4 years now.. and in just 4 years i have seen drastic changes in Marines fresh out of school. Very disrespectful they can get away with it because no one wants to hurt the PFC's feelings.... well guess what... YOU JOINED THE HARDEST BRANCH FOR A REASON..... you EARN the name MARINE... and if you dont like it.... do your 4 years a get out... Just shut up and stop Complaining about pettty things... stop worrying about your NCO or SNCO calling you a Devil Dog... worry about your brothers and sister that will no longer be able to hear the term devil dog...

OOOOOHHHH RRRRAAAHHHHH...
SEMPER FI !!!!

[SGT6124]

:mad2:

Can someone please help me understand why Devil Dog is such a "derogatory term"... why because some PFC got their feelings hurt when their NCO called them a Devil Dog... some PFC gets their feelings hurt cause you yell at them, all H**l breaks loose... i have been in the Marine Corps for 4 years now.. and in just 4 years i have seen drastic changes in Marines fresh out of school. Very disrespectful they can get away with it because no one wants to hurt the PFC's feelings.... well guess what... YOU JOINED THE HARDEST BRANCH FOR A REASON..... you EARN the name MARINE... and if you dont like it.... do your 4 years a get out... Just shut up and stop Complaining about pettty things... stop worrying about your NCO or SNCO calling you a Devil Dog... worry about your brothers and sister that will no longer be able to hear the term devil dog...

OOOOOHHHH RRRRAAAHHHHH...
SEMPER FI !!!!

OOH RAH HARD CHARGER! WELL PUT!

[TJMAC77SP]

If an NCO was going to 'correct' a Marine and not use the term Devil Dog, I imagine he/she would use either the term Marine or just the individual's rank. Since the 'correction' will be spoken in the same tone no matter what the means of address, does the term Marine or the rank at some point become derogatroy as well?

[kleverton]

Once upon a time, I was a junior Navy Corpsman serving with "my" Devil Dogs @ 1stMarDiv. The term was used with admiration and pride to those it was directed, much the same when they called me "doc". These were terms that were earned, not taken for granted. If the junior troops weren't called DD, they hadn't yet "made it" with the unit. In my day, the moniker Devil Dog was used to instill pride and espirit de corps with our close knit ranks and was also used to motivate the younger troops. It's been a while since I served with the USMC and from what I'm reading in these threads, the SNCO community has apparently turned the term into a derogatory one. That's too bad. With all the other things we face in our daily lives, forgetting our traditions and heritage and letting them go in the face of being "PC" is shameful.

I agree, when addressing those of higher rank, use the approriate rank/name to open communication. It's proper military bearing. When dealing with junior troops, I see nothing wrong with using Devil Dog as long as it's used properly (ie - not to replace a derogatory term). If you're trying to motivate that newly promoted PFC into doing one more pullup during his PFT, screaming "Let's go Devil Dog, one more!" is intended to help, not hurt. I've done/seen a lot in my 21+ years and find this shameful that a once proud term of endearment is slowly eroding.

[LILLEO1823]

I CANNOT stand to be called "Devil-Dog".. It is very true that the only time it is used to when a Junior Marine is being corrected. In my four short year in the Marine Corps, I have probably only heard the term used correctly in bootcamp.

I can still hear my old SgtMaj saying, "HEY DEVIL! GET A HAIRCUT!"

I feel "Devil-Dog" might as well be used in place of "Jar-head."

[AH/U1HMECH]

Next they will be complaining because they dont get cookies and milk, along with a nap during the day.

[marinevet2008]

It's sad to see these young kids complaining about something so prevalent in our history. They all fail to realize what the term devil dog really means to every Marine. It's who we all are. If you're hearing it too much, it's because you're screwing up too much. Fix yourself, and the issue goes away.

[Unregistered]

Listen up, Devil Dogs.

Oh yeah, that got your attention. Perhaps it even got your blood boiling? Or maybe you didn’t notice the big double-D.

Lately, reactions to the Corps’ longtime nickname generally depend on the age of the Marine listening.

A generational divide is opening around the term “Devil Dog,” which came into use 90 years ago on the battlefields of France. While it’s been a term of colloquial endearment for generations of leathernecks, some of the newest and youngest Marines say they’re tired of being called Devil Dogs. They even take offense at the term.

That came as a surprise to former Staff Sgt. Glenn Kirst, a 34-year-old financial advisor in Milwaukee who joined the Corps in 1991 and spent 10 years on active duty. He was out shopping with his girlfriend a few weeks ago when the pair passed a Marine in the parking lot of a Best Buy store.

Kirst grinned and nodded at the Marine, sporting a “USMC” T-shirt and close-cropped hair as he walked with a girlfriend.

“I said ‘Hey, there’s another Devil Dog,’” Kirst recalled. The Marine gave him a blank stare and the Marine’s girlfriend got angry. “She started shouting at me. ‘Before you make a comment like that, why don’t you grow some f---ing balls and serve your country.’”

“I was stunned,” Kirst said. “I called my friend, who is a Marine captain in the infantry. He told me the term ‘Devil Dog’ is not used much anymore, and is usually used in a negative manner. I couldn’t believe what I was hearing.

“When I was in the Corps, I used the nickname Devil Dog like a badge of honor.”


To read the full article, please go here ---> http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/issues/stories/0-MARINEPAPER-3482634.php or check out the cover story in the hard copy of Marine Corps Times.

I was a Marine and I was proud of being called "Devil Dog" if this new Marines are complaining about being "devil dogged" by somebody they need to suck it up and get squared away, the phrase devil dog should be respected and you earn the title and you earn the name also.

[fmrldylthrnk]

I’m glad devil dog is dying out. I’ve always been offended when people have called me that, leatherneck, hardcore, hard charger, motivator, stellar, high-speed, or lance criminal. I’ve even been offended when the rank was right, but the inflection was wrong (“Get over here LANCE corporal”). The way the word lance drips of my corporal’s tongue makes me irate. Just because she has 2 months more of time-in-service than me DOESN’T make her better than me. Honestly, I think the Air Force has it right. I don’t usually agree with them, but it’s time we start using first names instead of rank or nicknames. What’s the harm? You don’t have to “devil dog” me to assert your authority. I get the fact you’re pissed off at me merely by your inflection. So, that time my rack wasn’t perfect for field day, Heather’s leadership and power over me would have come across just as clearly if she addressed me by my first name. I say be a leader by your ACTIONS, not how well you can take a term that was once endearing and make it derogatory. A first name Corps is a first rate Corps.

-Brian
Camp Lejeune

Brian, Brian, Brian,
All I can say is that your mentality is what's wrong with the Corps today.
You wanna start calling people by their first names, then the Air Force is for you--or better yet, 1stCivDiv.
There are tried and true reasons why the Corps does what it does; and when you earn the rank, you earn the right to be addressed by the rank whether YOU personally agree with it.
Fix your rack, fix yourself, and stop pissing and moaning.

[fmrldylthrnk]

:mad2:
stop worrying about your NCO or SNCO calling you a Devil Dog... worry about your brothers and sister that will no longer be able to hear the term devil dog...

OOOOOHHHH RRRRAAAHHHHH...
SEMPER FI !!!!

and a yut, yut.
There are bigger fish to fry people.

[Cyberuff]

I CANNOT stand to be called "Devil-Dog".. It is very true that the only time it is used to when a Junior Marine is being corrected. In my four short year in the Marine Corps, I have probably only heard the term used correctly in bootcamp.

I can still hear my old SgtMaj saying, "HEY DEVIL! GET A HAIRCUT!"

I feel "Devil-Dog" might as well be used in place of "Jar-head."


You kidding me? YOU ARE A DEVIL DOG!!!!! You young Marines MUST be kidding me. Seriously WHY DID you join if you can't stand being called a DEVIL DOG.. Hell Thats like taking offence to being called a MARINE.
DEVIL DOG, MARINE... SAME THING!!!!

[Unregistered]

I think that when junior Marines are calling other junior Marines Devil Dogs is where it gets disrespectful.
I don't mind it because of the history of the nickname. If some Boot Ass PFC calls me Devil or Devil Dog i get heated.

[Unregistered]

These Junior Marines just aren't it these days. They get weaker and weaker, they cry more, and need someone to wipe their ass. Mind you there are still the few that will make outstanding Marines but the majority are 'pussies'. We can't curse at them, can't call them Devil Dogs?! Whats next are their mommys going to be on the bus with them to boot? We are the MARINES not the army, navy, or air force. We are the toughest in the world. If you're going to cry about being a Devil Dog than join the fucking army. If you're going to cry about being corrected in boot camp than join the fucking air force. Devil Dog is a tradition and shouldn't be disrespected like it is. Before one of you Boots decide to complain look up your Marine Corps history.

[70sMarine]

I do not recall the frequent use of "Devil Dog" back in the 70s. Oh yeah, we were and are Teuflehundens! We are the hounds from hell the huns feared. And some of our recent enemies learned just how vicious Devil Dogs can be in close quarters fighting. But going around and saying, "Hey Devil Dog!" to greet one another wasn't a practice, and neither was greeting with "Ooh Rah." Chewin' out a subordinate using the words Devil Dog was not anything I remember. The most common term, and rightful title used - positive and negative - was MARINE! I got out in 79. I got back in in 03 to serve in the GWOT. Call me MARINE, call me Teuflehunden, call me Leatherneck. But be careful on how you refer to me using "Devil Dog." The way the words "Devil Dog" are used today is not fitting of what it means to be a Teuflehunden. I've heard, "Hey Dawg! What's Up?" It's used like some street slang. If you want to call me Devil Dog, you'd better be referring to me with the respect and awe that the Hun officer meant when he wrote to his superiors that the Marines fought like hounds from hell! We are a special breed, the Teuflehunden breed ... that even the AKC can't handle. We are more than the Sheepdogs that Lt.Col. Grossman speaks of in ON COMBAT, for WE ARE TEUFLEHUNDENS! It's up to all Marines, past-present-future, to regain the true meaning and essence of such names as Devil Dogs, Leathernecks, Grunts, etc. And greetings like Ooh Rah ... something I like that's different from the 70s. In THE FORGOTTEN SOLDIER the phrase "Ooh Rah Padeida" is used by the Siberians as a war cry as they approached the battered German front they had shelled massively. What it means, who knows? But it's a war cry of some sort, and fitting for MARINES, yeah - fitting of DEVIL DOGS! Semper Fi to all my fellow Marines, and fearless Teuflehundens!

[MACHINE666]

I’m glad devil dog is dying out. I’ve always been offended when people have called me that, leatherneck, hardcore, hard charger, motivator, stellar, high-speed, or lance criminal. I’ve even been offended when the rank was right, but the inflection was wrong (“Get over here LANCE corporal”). The way the word lance drips of my corporal’s tongue makes me irate. Just because she has 2 months more of time-in-service than me DOESN’T make her better than me. Honestly, I think the Air Force has it right. I don’t usually agree with them, but it’s time we start using first names instead of rank or nicknames. What’s the harm? You don’t have to “devil dog” me to assert your authority. I get the fact you’re pissed off at me merely by your inflection. So, that time my rack wasn’t perfect for field day, Heather’s leadership and power over me would have come across just as clearly if she addressed me by my first name. I say be a leader by your ACTIONS, not how well you can take a term that was once endearing and make it derogatory. A first name Corps is a first rate Corps.

-Brian
Camp Lejeune

Usually it's the officer corps that uses first-names with one another - the flying community and colonels primarily - myself and the majority of NCOs in our flight still use proper title - aka "Airman" or "Sergeant" when addressing someone, even if we're the same rank.

Brian, you can make anything sound derogatory depending on how you phrase it. I think what you're trying to say is that you don't like being spoken down to in order to get your attention. Well I hate to say it but it's the same for all the branches if you're lower enlisted. We have Airmen who complain about the same thing (and in some cases are absolutely justified) when some high-and-mighty NCO type thinks their stripes afford them more than they're entitled to. Granted there is a time and place for everything, and if you're screwing up bad, gentle correction may not be the best approach to take. The best thing for you to do is to (a) accept that this mentality is part of the military heritage and realize that this will never change, (b) get a commission and become an officer or a warrant officer, or (c) simply finish up the remainder of your military commitment and then separate. I've been in for 18+ plus years buddy, and it's no different then as it is now.

[TJMAC77SP]

I do not recall the frequent use of "Devil Dog" back in the 70s. Oh yeah, we were and are Teuflehundens! We are the hounds from hell the huns feared. And some of our recent enemies learned just how vicious Devil Dogs can be in close quarters fighting. But going around and saying, "Hey Devil Dog!" to greet one another wasn't a practice, and neither was greeting with "Ooh Rah." Chewin' out a subordinate using the words Devil Dog was not anything I remember. The most common term, and rightful title used - positive and negative - was MARINE! I got out in 79. I got back in in 03 to serve in the GWOT. Call me MARINE, call me Teuflehunden, call me Leatherneck. But be careful on how you refer to me using "Devil Dog." The way the words "Devil Dog" are used today is not fitting of what it means to be a Teuflehunden. I've heard, "Hey Dawg! What's Up?" It's used like some street slang. If you want to call me Devil Dog, you'd better be referring to me with the respect and awe that the Hun officer meant when he wrote to his superiors that the Marines fought like hounds from hell! We are a special breed, the Teuflehunden breed ... that even the AKC can't handle. We are more than the Sheepdogs that Lt.Col. Grossman speaks of in ON COMBAT, for WE ARE TEUFLEHUNDENS! It's up to all Marines, past-present-future, to regain the true meaning and essence of such names as Devil Dogs, Leathernecks, Grunts, etc. And greetings like Ooh Rah ... something I like that's different from the 70s. In THE FORGOTTEN SOLDIER the phrase "Ooh Rah Padeida" is used by the Siberians as a war cry as they approached the battered German front they had shelled massively. What it means, who knows? But it's a war cry of some sort, and fitting for MARINES, yeah - fitting of DEVIL DOGS! Semper Fi to all my fellow Marines, and fearless Teuflehundens!


Off topic but.....you got out in 1979 and went back into the Marines in 2003? I entered the Air Force in late 1977 and retired 1 April 2003. That is over 25 years and I was 46 years old. What is the maximum age the Marines will take?

[lcpldontknow]

Brian, you can make anything sound derogatory depending on how you phrase it. I think what you're trying to say is that you don't like being spoken down to in order to get your attention. Well I hate to say it but it's the same for all the branches if you're lower enlisted. We have Airmen who complain about the same thing (and in some cases are absolutely justified) when some high-and-mighty NCO type thinks their stripes afford them more than they're entitled to. Granted there is a time and place for everything, and if you're screwing up bad, gentle correction may not be the best approach to take. The best thing for you to do is to (a) accept that this mentality is part of the military heritage and realize that this will never change, (b) get a commission and become an officer or a warrant officer, or (c) simply finish up the remainder of your military commitment and then separate. I've been in for 18+ plus years buddy, and it's no different then as it is now.

Machine, you cut through my BS and realized the point I was making. It doesn't matter what you say, it's your inflection. Take appropriate corrective action when necessary - but think what that is before you actually do it - gentle or harsh correction (both have a time and place). Devil Dogging some new PFC for a minor thing IS going to instill a negative response to the term. It's not his fault he hates being called Devil Dog. The same people who are saying we are losing our heritage are the SAME people using Devil Dog as a way to admonish a Marine. Rank - even private - is a title earned - just as Marine is. My TRUE belief is that rank should always be used, even if you're are a higher rank addressing a lower rank. Marines it's time to step up and reclaim "Devil Dog" - and it starts with the leadership (and, really, the MCT instructors who refuse to call Marines, Marines). Instead of posting on message board why you think anyone is stupid for not like the term "Devil Dog", start using it as a term of endearment and watch change happen.

And, Machine, thanks again for actually reading the post to see what I was trying to say.

[challedog]

The most common phase I ever heard while in the Marines was, "WHAT THE F**K DEVIL DOG?". From boot camp through NCO school.

If the Corps wants to continue with tradition, and retain DEVIL DOG as a term of respect, then those that use it should use it as a term of respect. The negative connotation is a result of improper use by those in authority. I admittedly used that phase as well when I was an NCO. However, I also used Devil Dog when congratulating the Marines under my charge. The most common phrase which I uttered was, "THAT'S OUTSTANDING DEVIL DOG", seconded by, "OOH RAH, DEVIL DOG", for a job well done.

[Unregistered]

Wow, I was slightly amazed after reading this post. Do any of these Marines that get offended or that us the term in a derogatory way even understand the true meaning behind Devil Dog?
I'm sure we all know that this term came about in World War I from the German Infantry after they encountered the United States Marines on the battlefield. These German fighters were so amazed at the force that these Marines fought that they started using the term "Teufels hunde" or "Devil Dog". I would see that as a great compliment not as being something offensive or degrading.

[Unregistered]

for those senior enlisted who think that devil dog is such a 'good thing,' and don't understand what's all the complaining about, allow your 'devil dogs' to devil dog you. picture that... a lance corporal devil doggin' his GySgt.... i can picture myself laughing at that situation.

[lil'mama]

I agree that the term "Devil Dog" is used in a derogatory way. I'm guilty of that. But I did it because when you use a term like "What the f*** Devil Dog!" you are reminding these junior Marines that yes, you are a Devil Dog, snap back in reality about who you are. I know it may not be the proper way, and you do have to balance that with a "Good job Devil Dogs," or "Outstanding Devil Dog." But let's think on this for just one second... There are many things that are allowed and it's pure laziness. One of my biggest pet peeves is when you say "OOH-RAH Marine!" and the response you get back is "rrrrrr". What the crap is that? If you don't want to OOH-RAH back then fine, but rrrrrr? Lazy. My time in the Marine Corps is up and although I stayed around Marine Corps towns for a while, I decided to come home and guess what. See a Marine out and try to talk to them, they gaff you off mostly. Ridiculous. If anything, I have this to say: Be proud of your heritage. You CHOSE to be a Marine, you weren't drafted and forced in. Stand by the names our fore fathers earned for us for they all are special. If you are ashamed of who you are and your heritage, then you are truly not a Devil Dog, but a Devil Dork

[MGunz]

Leatherneck, Devil Dog, Soldier of the Sea, Maritime Mercenary, Jarhead, and Sea Going Bellhop! All these terms are synonymous with the title, "Marine". After doing my own survey, the majority of the Marines felt that the term, "Devil Dog" was just as good today as it was when it was first used. When asked if a snarling SNCO might call them, "Marine" in the same tone as Devil Dog is sometimes used, they stated they had no problem with that. Obviously, the "Devil Dogs" of today need to delve back into the history books and realize that this term is a term of endearment and not meant to be derogatory in any way. From now on, I'll make it a point to call Marines, "Devil Dog" and if they have a problem with that, I'll tell them it's time to depart the Corps!!

[Unregistered]

for those senior enlisted who think that devil dog is such a 'good thing,' and don't understand what's all the complaining about, allow your 'devil dogs' to devil dog you. picture that... a lance corporal devil doggin' his GySgt.... i can picture myself laughing at that situation.

Devil Dog ME, Devil Dog! I'm proud of that term and you should be too!!

[Unregistered]

Marine, Devil, Leatherneck, yes, all of that is what I am. I am a mother, a wife, a sister and a daughter too. Every morning for the past 6 years, I wake up and put on my uniform and I still look at the name tape that says US Marines and then my name. And I am still amazed that I am still here.
I have been "Devil Dogged" more times then I can count. And yes, most of the time it was because I was doing something that should not have. On that same note, I would rather be called a Devil Dog out of anger, then what they may have really wanted to say.
Gentlemen, I am stating the obvious, but your haircut is a givaway out in town. when you are in civillian attire, all that is seen is a hair cut. not your rank, not your name, not your time in the corps. To be called what you are is not some thing to get upset over. and if you do get upset, then get the hell out of my Corps. Marines now simply dont understand the history of the corps, or they just dont care. not about the traditions, the meaning.
I agree with what was said earlier, you joined the corp, the corp did not join you.

Semper Fidelis

[SgtHardCharger]

Wow, this one took me by surprise. Admittedly I spent my years in the Air Force but my opinion and observation has always been that the term Devil Dog was said and received with pride. In fact, so much so that I would hesitate to use it when addressing a Marine lest I am mistaken for a poser. I assume the history of the term is taught during Marine Boot so that every Marine knows the term was earned in the most honored way, given as a sign of respect by the enemy.

I know times change and I am beginning to sound like all the retirees I met during my career but…………what the hell is happening to us ?!?!?!?

This is new Marine Corps from the one I was in (1987 - 1997). Instead of trying to break these young hard charging devil dogs down (Yes, I said devil dogs) try to build them up. I blame the new SNCO's and NCO's for the way things are now, it is just crazy.

[Unregistered]

Tough for the junior Marines! It's a tradition. The senior Marines have the final say. You can't just join a unit and say "I don't like the name let's change it"! It won't fly.
Sean

[Unregistered]

I love the idea that just because you don't like being called Devil Dog you're whining. Many of us hear it and suck it up. the fact remains that it is used as a condescending term now. Does this mean it should go away, maybe, maybe not. But to deny that it is a way of talking down to someone is ignorant. To call someone senior to you Devil Dog or Marine is a pretty unacceptable offence, but it's okay in reverse? As for the people who don't want to worry about what's on your collar, would it be okay for a junior Marine (who has a lot more to try and count when he's looking at a E-8/E-9's collar then vice versa?) Even Marines of the same rank don't refer to themselves as Marines or Devil Dogs. It's because it is unacceptable to refer to your equal or senior as either of these terms that they have come to mean "Hey person who is of lesser rank then me, and who I don't even have to care what your name or rank is." Take even the example of a Lt., fresh out of TBS calling a MGySgt/SgtMaj Devil Dog or Marine. Would it fly? Absolutely not. Because even though they're junior to them, at that point you won't stand for being talked down to. Regardless of what it meant in the past, it now is a term of condescension whether being used to compliment or correct someone, and to point that out is not complaining simply stating a fact.

[Unregistered]

So if the Marines commenting that they don't like the term Devil Dog are whining or bitching, anyone care to tell me what the people crying about how soft the Corps is are doing?

[Unregistered]

I have got to admit I was gobsmacked. I'm not certain how referring to someone by their rank softens the blow of getting reprimanded. In fact it's belittling. The title of Devil Dog erases all rank; placing all Marines as equals and subordinate to no one. But, hey, if the younger generation feels they need to be coddled, maybe the next time they step out of line the DI can reprimand by yelling "Hey, Buttercup, step it up!"

[Unregistered]

I personally do not like being called a Devil Dog. One, I didn't serve in Europe when it happened so I don't feel like I should be called that and two I don't want someone to call me a Devil. Overall, I feel like the term is something that should be done away with. But with higher ranking individuals still remembering the old times it will probably be another millenium before it does dissappear.

Let me see if I have this correct... You joined a military branch with a rich and storied history and then don't want to share, good or bad, in it? Maybe you should have paused a moment before enlisting.

[SGT6124]

This is rediculous! In a few years you will be reading a forum saying " I don't want you to call me a Marine". If you get people to stop calling you a Devil Dog, then what is left? So when some one says something to correct you starting with hey Marine instead of devil dog, someone is going to piss and moan about that too. Shut your lips, grab your rifle and do your job! After all, that is what you get paid for, not crying about being called a Devil Dog!

[KnoxRJ]

As I reread the Times article about our junior troops who do not like being called Devil Dog because of the perceived negative connotations I can't help but feel that maybe they need to understand that they are being reminded that they are Marines and as such there is a certain standard that they are REQUIRED to uphold.

I can't help but see the issue that if we were to say "Hey Marine" fix yourself over and over these same young troops would then claim the name Marine was a negative term but if we said "Hey idiot", "hey dummy", "hey stupid" fix yourself then they would have a gripe or complaint even though their substandard performance or act detract from what being a Marine is all about.

The Corps needs to stop coddling this new generation and start coming down hard on misdeeds and get the Corps back on track to the level of pride, respect, and distinction we used to have and uphold or we may as well just disband and join the Army.

[e3grunt]

any thing that the higher ups will call u can be negative . i fucking hate being called devildog, i prefer to be called by my rank even tho it is as an e3. but i cant say hey devildog to a higher up with out be yelled at. it can be me being disrespectful, but they are a devil dog right? the corps does need to stop coddling shit tho. but if im out in town, in civies and some crusty looking guy with a high and tight(warning sign its a higherup) says hey there devildog , its just rude .

[KnoxRJ]

How is it rude being called Devil Dog? You obvious looked like a Marine to some degree while in civvies that it got you recognized. Do you have E-3 labeled on your clothes or forehead?! How about if the crusty guy called you "son" so he could treat you like his son? Maybe you all would like that because parents obviously are not incorporating respect in their kids now days and someone needs to do it. A little tough love goes a long way.

[Unregistered]

I cannot believe what I am reading!!!! Let me first state that I am a Retired Gunnery Sergeant. When I first learned about the term "Devil Dog" was in boot camp. The feeling of Honor! and Pride! that I took from this phrase you cannot measure! I had to EARN! the right to be called by this nickname (As it was EARNED by the Marines that proceeded me.) When a Marine is "Called to Task" because they may have done something wrong or ARE IN THE PROCESS OF TARNISHING THE HONOR of those that have proceeded them this should not be construed as a derogatory use of the phrase or nick name.. It should be taken for what it is.... A call to task (i.e. "YOU SHOULD KNOW BETTER! YOU WERE TAUGHT BETTER!) There was an article that was published in the Marine Corps Times sometime in the 80's. I saved a copy of it but unfortunately I cannot find it as I write this to be able to quote a month or year. The basic premis of the article was that If we as individuals (SNCO's, NCO's, "MARINES"!!!! FAIL to say something when we see an injustice being done then we do an injustice to both our Corps and our Heritage!!!!! I was sorry to read of this tragic turn in the understanding or use of the term "DEVIL DOG". If anyone would like to contact me in regards to my comments my E-mail is jlandgraff@zoominternet.net "Semper Fi"
Listen up, Devil Dogs.

Oh yeah, that got your attention. Perhaps it even got your blood boiling? Or maybe you didn’t notice the big double-D.

Lately, reactions to the Corps’ longtime nickname generally depend on the age of the Marine listening.

A generational divide is opening around the term “Devil Dog,” which came into use 90 years ago on the battlefields of France. While it’s been a term of colloquial endearment for generations of leathernecks, some of the newest and youngest Marines say they’re tired of being called Devil Dogs. They even take offense at the term.

That came as a surprise to former Staff Sgt. Glenn Kirst, a 34-year-old financial advisor in Milwaukee who joined the Corps in 1991 and spent 10 years on active duty. He was out shopping with his girlfriend a few weeks ago when the pair passed a Marine in the parking lot of a Best Buy store.

Kirst grinned and nodded at the Marine, sporting a “USMC” T-shirt and close-cropped hair as he walked with a girlfriend.

“I said ‘Hey, there’s another Devil Dog,’” Kirst recalled. The Marine gave him a blank stare and the Marine’s girlfriend got angry. “She started shouting at me. ‘Before you make a comment like that, why don’t you grow some f---ing balls and serve your country.’”

“I was stunned,” Kirst said. “I called my friend, who is a Marine captain in the infantry. He told me the term ‘Devil Dog’ is not used much anymore, and is usually used in a negative manner. I couldn’t believe what I was hearing.

“When I was in the Corps, I used the nickname Devil Dog like a badge of honor.”


To read the full article, please go here ---> http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/issues/stories/0-MARINEPAPER-3482634.php or check out the cover story in the hard copy of Marine Corps Times.

[Unregistered]

I disagree! the phrase should be able to be used "up or down" the chain of command. The term Devil Dog is Universal to all Marines. However I have been retired for 8 years. Maybe I am missing something here!
I love the idea that just because you don't like being called Devil Dog you're whining. Many of us hear it and suck it up. the fact remains that it is used as a condescending term now. Does this mean it should go away, maybe, maybe not. But to deny that it is a way of talking down to someone is ignorant. To call someone senior to you Devil Dog or Marine is a pretty unacceptable offence, but it's okay in reverse? As for the people who don't want to worry about what's on your collar, would it be okay for a junior Marine (who has a lot more to try and count when he's looking at a E-8/E-9's collar then vice versa?) Even Marines of the same rank don't refer to themselves as Marines or Devil Dogs. It's because it is unacceptable to refer to your equal or senior as either of these terms that they have come to mean "Hey person who is of lesser rank then me, and who I don't even have to care what your name or rank is." Take even the example of a Lt., fresh out of TBS calling a MGySgt/SgtMaj Devil Dog or Marine. Would it fly? Absolutely not. Because even though they're junior to them, at that point you won't stand for being talked down to. Regardless of what it meant in the past, it now is a term of condescension whether being used to compliment or correct someone, and to point that out is not complaining simply stating a fact.

[Mateo820506]

Case in point..."What has happened to my beloved Corps?" is right on this thread with the bickering back and forth. If the two of you want to do that then send each other messeges instead of wasting space on this thread. Stay on topic.

Anyways....you can always tell if a Marine is being spoken to in a negative way. It doesn't matter if they are saying Marine, Devil Dog, or just Hey. We actually joke about this topic in my workcenter. You hear it and kinda say to yourself dang I just got double D'd. But brush it off. It is always being said from senior Marine to junior Marine. If a senior Marine were to get Devil Dogged by a junior, wow that would not go over too well. There is a paradox between what is acceptable and what is not. A term like that should be used up and down the ranks with pride. Besides its not every instance you can see a Marine's rank. I'm going to put it to the test and start saying good morning or afternoon Devil Dog to who ever passes me instead of saying Sir. I'll let you know how that goes.

[Unregistered]

I misquoted in my previous post. The article that I spoke of was originally published in "Leather Neck Magazine" in the 80's. (jlandgraff)
I cannot believe what I am reading!!!! Let me first state that I am a Retired Gunnery Sergeant. When I first learned about the term "Devil Dog" was in boot camp. The feeling of Honor! and Pride! that I took from this phrase you cannot measure! I had to EARN! the right to be called by this nickname (As it was EARNED by the Marines that proceeded me.) When a Marine is "Called to Task" because they may have done something wrong or ARE IN THE PROCESS OF TARNISHING THE HONOR of those that have proceeded them this should not be construed as a derogatory use of the phrase or nick name.. It should be taken for what it is.... A call to task (i.e. "YOU SHOULD KNOW BETTER! YOU WERE TAUGHT BETTER!) There was an article that was published in the Marine Corps Times sometime in the 80's. I saved a copy of it but unfortunately I cannot find it as I write this to be able to quote a month or year. The basic premis of the article was that If we as individuals (SNCO's, NCO's, "MARINES"!!!! FAIL to say something when we see an injustice being done then we do an injustice to both our Corps and our Heritage!!!!! I was sorry to read of this tragic turn in the understanding or use of the term "DEVIL DOG". If anyone would like to contact me in regards to my comments my E-mail is jlandgraff@zoominternet.net "Semper Fi"

[Unregistered]

What a load of SH**, Devil Dog!!!! That term can and does stand for many things. Derogatory is not one of them. If I, as a E5 walk up on a junior Marine and notice he's walking around without his headgear, I might say "What the Hell Devil dog!", just like it was mentioned used as this it's a reminder of who and what you/we are. The Marines are/were the elite of the US Armed Forces, with a long and proudly earned reputation. "Leatherneck, Jarhead, Gyrene, Marine, DEVIL DOG"!!!!!, nick names that set us apart from all others. A reminder that when the US Army couldn't handle the job at Belleau Woods, they sent in the Marines and we kicked butt, and scared the Germans so badly they gave us that name. The newer generation of crybabies, and whinny butt, mamma's boys can get out and stop disgracing the Corps. As for the girlfriend who didn't like johnny boy being called a Devil Dog, if she had said that to me I would have slapped her boy so hard she would've bled. I didn't hear if she had the guts to go to PI or not. And the e3grunt......take some english and spelling classes. You're an embarassment to the 0311's.

[OLD SCHOOL]

To the young Marine, who identified himself as Brian. I think it is time for a reality check. The concept of a Lcpl calling a cpl or higher by first name at work, is not gonna happen. I am a SNCO, I have earned the right to addressed correctly, just as any other Marine (from private to general). You are a Marine 24/7 until your EAS. Yes, you are still Brian, but Brian also happens to be in the Marine corps, so time to square away your attitude and get with the program "DEVIL DOG". This is the Marine Corps your talking about.

[Unregistered]

hey old school! this is rob, a proud civilian that got out in 06. I served your corps for 4 years and your right, you got dirtbags that play cute games and want to call everyone by their first names, but how r u gonna fight the fact that you being a snco r the reason that my generation hates being called a devil dog. You ruined it yourself by using it so often that it became just as retarded as the army caling eachother whoha's all the time. SO GET WITH THE PROGRAM OLD SCHOOL. UR CORPS JOINED IN A TIME OF PEACE AND RUINED IT FOR MY GENERATION

[SGT6124]

hey old school! this is rob, a proud civilian that got out in 06. I served your corps for 4 years and your right, you got dirtbags that play cute games and want to call everyone by their first names, but how r u gonna fight the fact that you being a snco r the reason that my generation hates being called a devil dog. You ruined it yourself by using it so often that it became just as retarded as the army caling eachother whoha's all the time. SO GET WITH THE PROGRAM OLD SCHOOL. UR CORPS JOINED IN A TIME OF PEACE AND RUINED IT FOR MY GENERATION

um.....WAH!

[Former_Marine_23]

Besides its not every instance you can see a Marine's rank. I'm going to put it to the test and start saying good morning or afternoon Devil Dog to who ever passes me instead of saying Sir. I'll let you know how that goes.

I can already tell you how that one is going to go!

You: "Good Afternoon Devil Dog!"

Some Random Officer: "What the fuck did you just call me?"


You: "Good Afternoon Devil Dog!"

Some Random Sgt Major: "What the fuck did you just call me?" "You must have lost your fucking mind!"


You: "Good Afternoon Devil Dog!"

Me: "Are you kidding me?" "Why the hell do you have such a problem addressing a Marine by their Rank and name? Or if you can't see their rank, just go with an OOO-RAH and be done with it!"

[e3grunt]

What a load of SH**, Devil Dog!!!! That term can and does stand for many things. Derogatory is not one of them. If I, as a E5 walk up on a junior Marine and notice he's walking around without his headgear, I might say "What the Hell Devil dog!", just like it was mentioned used as this it's a reminder of who and what you/we are. The Marines are/were the elite of the US Armed Forces, with a long and proudly earned reputation. "Leatherneck, Jarhead, Gyrene, Marine, DEVIL DOG"!!!!!, nick names that set us apart from all others. A reminder that when the US Army couldn't handle the job at Belleau Woods, they sent in the Marines and we kicked butt, and scared the Germans so badly they gave us that name. The newer generation of crybabies, and whinny butt, mamma's boys can get out and stop disgracing the Corps. As for the girlfriend who didn't like johnny boy being called a Devil Dog, if she had said that to me I would have slapped her boy so hard she would've bled. I didn't hear if she had the guts to go to PI or not. And the e3grunt......take some english and spelling classes. You're an embarassment to the 0311's.

what the fuck does belleau have to do with any thing , now a days. so if i walked up and said hey there sgt jarhead, or sgt devildog, or sgt pog, u wouldnt get mad? sorry i didnt do the mci on spelling i was a little to busy learning about machine guns.

[ArmyCPT]

The Army calls each other what?

[Unregistered]

Just to clue everyone in... Devil Dog is no longer used as a good thing. Mostly it is used like our parents used our middle name, only when we effed up. Never would you hear a junior Marine call his Gunny devil dog.

Also to the Marine coming out of Best Buy. You ever have a different branch call you devil dog? He didn't know who you were and probably assumed you were some civilian who had heard it somewhere and thought that you knew what you were talking about. How about just using Semper Fi, Semper Stupid, Ooh Rah, ERRR, Yut, or some other form of greeting. Until leadership starts using DD as a good thing, it will forever be associated with disrespect.

I for one think Devil Dog could have the potential that the Germans meant for it to be. Think about that. Effing Hell Hounds. Makes me stick my chest out and want to say You bet your effing ass.

As always feel free to send your hate mail to eattheapple25@gmail.com

Herring

[6019MGySgt]

The term "Devil Dog" has been misused by NCO's and SNCO's since the early 1990's. It started out as a term of honor but has rarely been used honorably since.
The Marines that misuse this term are the ones that think that "tact" is an optional Leadership Trait. Those Marines often lack self esteem and confidence in their own leadership abilities and think that the Drill Instructor leadership model is the only one. Marines that are corrected tactfully will be more likely to take the correction on board vice brushing it off as getting "devil dogged." Those who brush this off as being a weak approach are the ones who perpetuate the problem. A good leader can elicit positive results from his/her subordinates and generate respect at the same time.
The Marine Times article is dead-on when it says that "devil dog" is subsituted for "stupid" or worse.
Mutual respect for each other as Marines should be the point where we start from.

[70sMarine]

The age for new recruits is likely between 29-32...you'll need to check with a recruiter. Not all past Marines who've tried to get back in have received age waivers. Age waivers are given on an individual basis based on review of the Marine's background, medical condition, physical capabilities, and the need of the Corps. To get back in after all those years, I went through a litigation process at HQ USMC, went through 2 medical physicals in a year and a half, and passed the Corps physical fitness test. I began my effort to serve our nation again, as lean mean figthin' Marine (Devil Dog), after I witnessed the live broadcast of the second plane hitting the Tower ... when I put my face in my hands and yelled "WE'RE AT WAR!" And we are, primarily a 4th generation type war... and we must fight as vicious as any Teuflehunden from WW1. We must, and we will.

Now, I'm not pleased with the misuse or overuse of the words "Devil Dog", and correct those Marines who use it inappropriately. No Marine is a "Devil", nor a "Dawg"! We have the label "Teuflehunden" because of the viciousness in the way we fight our enemy. To all Marines, even those who've lost heart due to the foolishness of your SNCOs and NCOs misuse of the words, reclaim some pride in knowing you are still among The FEW in history who have EARNED the title of UNITED STATES MARINE - no SNCO or NCO misusing or abusing cherished tradition can ever take that from you. Don't take it from yourselves. You use it correctly, and do what you're able to educate others on the proper background and use.

Press onward fellow Marines, move "F" to the power of 3 - Fast, Forward, and Ferocious, and let us seek out, close with, and destroy our enemy with the viciousness of all the true Devil Dogs of history!

[70sMarine]

To the Air Force gentleman who inquired ... Ammendment to the maximum age comment I made earlier. I worded it such that the age for all recruits was 29-32. I meant to say the max age is probably somewhere in the range of 29-32. I suppose they still will recruit qualified individuals beginning around age 17, then up to that max range.

Now let's get back on topic, and see if our Marines can reclaim the pride in being a Devil Dog.

[ND Marine]

I served in the Marines from 1988- 1992. When I seen the headlines about "Devil Dog moniker taking a beating" I thought for sure it was from goodie two shoes thinking it was too offensive. I was surprised to hear it was coming from Marines. I think the term Devil Dog is one of the best ever. Born in blood and sacrifice, a name forged with the lives of young men from a different time. Retreat Hell, we just got here. I don't buy that WW I was too long ago, because Marine Corps History taught to Marines has no bearing on WHEN it happened, but THAT it happened, so therefore the time has no meaning. I can appreciate the fact that some young Marines associate it with being disciplined. But what if they were called " Hey square it away Marine" then what? Don't want to be called Marine? I am extremely disappointed with this whole situation. As proud as I am of being a Marine, and extremely proud of every Marine serving right now, this really bothers me. I am looking for "Devil Dog" T shirts online to buy, so I can wear them proudly. Of all the nicknames given to Marines, Devil Dog came at the most expense, most honor, and most blood. Not because we once WORE leather around our necks, or the covers we WEAR associate with jars. I appreciate the fact that each generation things change, and the name US Marines strikes fear all around the world. But there are some Marines in this world that love the name "Devil Dog", and when you Active Duty Marines are met by Marines from a different time; and we come up to you in airports and malls and shake your hand and express our gratitude for carrying on the tradition and for seving during a time of war for our Nation, don't chew our ass for calling you Devil Dog. Instead look into our eyes and see that we are calling you that with pride and look deeply to draw some of that pride in the name. Don't do it for me, do it for those that earned it at Belleau Wood in June of 1918. Do it for those that earned it on June 6, 1918, when the Marines suffered 1,087 dead or wounded. A day when a Naval Dental Officer was killed trying to save a Marine from enemy fire, earning the Medal of Honor and the French honoring him by naming a street after him. Don't think of this as scolding, but as an appeal as to why we should be damn proud of the name "Devil Dog". Semper Fi

[AYF1059]

I agree with LCpl 1371. The heavy useage of Devil Dog starts in SOI/MCT. I'll give the intructors there a little latitude because of the volume of students and work hours they must keep. I'm sure it can get a little hectic at times. However, when you get to MOS school and there are 6-10 of you in a class room environment and the head instructor of your course refuses to give you the respect of your rank or even last name by calling you Devil Dog umpteen times a day. Being double D'd gets old really fast. It almost makes you think some NCO's and SNCO's are too lazy to learn you name. Or that because your a non NCO or a boot you dont rate your name being used. I am infinitely proud of my service in the Marines, our history and taditions and I challenge anyone in or out of uniform to quiz me on history and traditions of our beloved Corps. So the traditions argument is moot. If I'm right or wrong, doing a good job or just plain jacked up. You can call me Marine, I earned the title through 13 weeks of hell on earth at MCRD Parris Island. I am also a Marine NCO and I have never and will never refer to any other Marine as Devil Dog.

[SGT6124]

Here is the truth, brace yourself it might hurt your feelings. If you weren't jacked up or wrong and needed to be corrected, then no one would devil dog you. Get the drift? Don't be mad at someone for having the testicular fortitude to correct a Marine. Just because he calls you a devil dog doesn't mean anything. Stop crying, this aint the girl scouts!

[Unregistered]

Bottom line is Devil - Dog is calling a Marine Satan's dog.
Child of Satan.
And most Marines are, if they claim that title. They will go straight to hell if they don't repent.

[fmrldylthrnk]

Bottom line is Devil - Dog is calling a Marine Satan's dog.
Child of Satan.
And most Marines are, if they claim that title. They will go straight to hell if they don't repent.

Because that's what the Bible says!

I must have a different version.

[ColdSteel]

"Last year, senior Navy officials grew concerned about the evolving use of the term “shipmate” and laid plans to reclaim it for general use. In October, they announced an essay-writing contest on the topic, “What being a shipmate means to me.”

I heard the Navy will be following this up with the "What being a shipmate means to me" coloring book contest due out next month.

That is too funny - Hey DON'T SCREW WITH THESE GUYS, THEY WILL WRITE THE S%^& OUT OF YOU!

[Unregistered]

Look. plain and simple, we got a bunch of cry babies on our hands. The term "Devil Dog" was given to us by our German advisaries in WW2. We all know that correct? The term is used loosely, but within reason. If you mess up, you hear " Hey Devil Dog!," but also if you do good, you hear " Good job, Devil Dog." It seems to me that there are just to many Marines that are more worried about what the Coprs can do for them, or has done to them, and not what can i do for the Corps. Wether you are called Devil Dog in correction, or praise is irrelivant. What is relivant is that you are called "Devil Dog." Think about Marines! It's time to wake up in more than sense!

[The Universal Curmudgeon_guest]

Look. plain and simple, we got a bunch of cry babies on our hands. The term "Devil Dog" was given to us by our German advisaries in WW2.I didn't know that the Battle of Belleau Wood (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Belleau_Wood) was in WWII.

Ain' id wunnerful whut ya lern onna innerned?

[The Universal Curmudgeon_guest]

I can already tell you how that one is going to go!

You: "Good Afternoon Devil Dog!"

Some Random Officer: "What the fuck did you just call me?"Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I'd never address a Marine as "Devil Dog" (no more than I would address one as "Jarhead").

On the other hand, I WOULD say something like "You are a 'Devil Dog' and don't you forget it.". (In some circumstances I would also substitute "Jarhead".)

It isn't the nickname that is offensive, it's the way that it is used. "Devil Dogs" (or Teufel Hunden if you prefer [or Teufelshunde if you actually speak German and want to get it correct]) has a long and illustrious history dating right back to when an American reporter invented the story about the German troops calling Marines "dogs of the devil" at the Battle of Belleau Wood. But, then again, Marines don't actually wear Mason jars for uniforms so the USN's approprition of "Jarhead" from the US Army and application to Marines is a bit suspect. But, then again, sailors seem somewhat unclear on the concept of digging holes in the dirt so their confusion of the two services that do it for a living can be rather easily explained.

[Unregistered]

Are we raising a generation of Marines that don't like to be called names..? They don't like to be corrected? What are we training in Parris Island? We have been called all kinds of slanderous names and they are taking offense to a title earned by the blood and sweat of those who went before….. I just don’t understand. I am proud to have earned the right to be called or to call some other Marine… Devil Dog. We are forgetting our past and it is our past that binds us.

[DaCWOT]

This issue came up when a SSgt friend of mine (we were both Sgts before I picked up WO) and I were discussing it. He said he would be offended if I called him Devil Dog. I didn't understand it. I actually love being called Devil Dog. It means I'm connected to those Marines who fought so fierce before me. Plus, I agree with the Marines in my age bracket (31-40). The younger generation is getting sensitive and offended over the littliest thing. When a old retired Marines comes up to me and say, "Hey Devil Dog" I reply with a loud, "OOH RAH". Even when people shorten it and just say, "Devil", its not a bad thing to me.

[Unregistered]

What's next after if we get rid of 'Devil Dog'........... "Marine"............. "Rank" ? Maybe we should just start using first names and coming to work in Civie's (a.k.a Civilian cloths)

[marinevet2008]

Bottom line is Devil - Dog is calling a Marine Satan's dog.
Child of Satan.
And most Marines are, if they claim that title. They will go straight to hell if they don't repent.

That is quite possibly the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. I really hope you're not a Marine, because you have a twisted life view.

[Unregistered]

Devil = Satan

What does a dog do? It is a servant, friend, guardian of who? The Devil. So Marines need to stop taking the Satan's name, if they consider themselves Christian.

Those Christians who are Marines call themselves Satan's Dogs with pride need to reconsider if they really have salvation in their heart.

[marinevet2008]

Devil = Satan

What does a dog do? It is a servant, friend, guardian of who? The Devil. So Marines need to stop taking the Satan's name, if they consider themselves Christian.

Those Christians who are Marines call themselves Satan's Dogs with pride need to reconsider if they really have salvation in their heart.

That is the biggest load of crap I have ever heard? Are you a Marine? If you are, you need to consider another branch.

[Unregistered]

"Hey Devil Dog, get off my grass"

So this offended you? So if he said, instead, "Hey Marine, get off my grass", eventually you guys would start complaining that Marine is used in a deragatory way too and not want to be called Marines? Give me a break. Seems like people are becoming too damn sensitive these days.

Understand, Devil Dog = Marine. As far as I'm concerned, it's the same thing. Hey Devil Dog, hey Marine. Same thing.

[fmrldylthrnk]

You know, I think I'll save us all a lot of time and effort and just sum it all up...



BOO-FRICKIN-HOO

[Unregistered]

Two days ago a Master Guns walked passed me. I gave him the proper greeting of the day and he said oohrah devil dog good morning. i began to think, in the past 4 years i have been in the corps has changed drastically. i over hear marines speaking of the changes that they have seen since they have been in. I do the classic collar check and theyre obviously junior(since boot cant be used either) marines. Where is the corps going. Everyday it changes more and more and it seems as though it is slowly becoming all about the junior marines. forget the NCO's and staff NCO's that have done more than what has been asked of them. Nevermind the lost. nevermind the men who fought for that name. nevermind our grandfathers who gave their lives in france to earn such a term that has inflicted fear around the world. What does this fresh shiny new marine want to cry about today? I dont like it either, but I am nothing but honored to carry the name of men who died for simply a title. a title that, though may be simple, has tremendous meaning and history. what happened to the days when there was no gray. no feelings. no pissing and moaning about what ever a "junior" marine doesnt like. GET OVER IT!! black and white. but those days are over. the old marine corps spirit is beginning to be lost to children. boys. those who havent even reached an age to drink but can go out and do amazing things on the battlefield. and were worried about who's feelings are hurt about being called devil dog. with all the changes nearing week by week i could not helo but think of that Master Guns. I never knew him, only talked in passing, yet what does HE feel? if I can see this change and feel the way i do, how does HE feel? a man who rates to have a feeling. it has become clear that junior marines are learning how to mold the marine corps to what THEY want it to be. its all about what they will whine about next.

[jarhead67]

I served from June '68 thru June '78. Devil Dog was absolutely '"NOT" a derrogatory term. We 'Nam vets were proud of our heritage, and being called "Devil Dog" was akin to being praised as a top-flight fighting Marine. To the "NEW" Marines of today, all I can say is this, "You all can call me a Devil Dog any time you like. I will definitely not take offense!"

[SGT6124]

Devil = Satan

What does a dog do? It is a servant, friend, guardian of who? The Devil. So Marines need to stop taking the Satan's name, if they consider themselves Christian.

Those Christians who are Marines call themselves Satan's Dogs with pride need to reconsider if they really have salvation in their heart.

Are you serious? That's all I can say about this one.

[Unregistered Sailor]

hell, it's the same exact thing with "shipmate" in the navy. you only hear it in training or when someone's about to hem you up. try to call an E7 or above a shipmate and see how far you make it down the p-way. so forgive us if we only say it sarcastically to our peers. and the whole thing about not knowing our history is bullshit. i think i speak for a lot of active duty sailors and marines when i say that we have the utmost respect for the old ways, but we're completely separated from the miltary of the past, so it's hard to treat it the same. sailors and marines brought tattoos to the western world but now we can't have them? we have to apologize for everything we do? i personally would rather serve 50 years ago than now, but what can you do? i still put my uniform on every morning and come to work for my country, but believe me - if anyone E5 or below calls me a "shipmate" in seriousness, then i'm going to be the one dressing them down.

[Gunny_2862]

I'd be careful if you claim that title, lest the day you die, you find your rightful owner (Satan) will take you to your hellish eternal home.

As long as he provides me with the internet to keep current on world events, football, and, at a minimum, a three bedroom home with an in-ground swimming pool/hot tub and live in cook/maid, He can take me wherever he chooses...as long as he takes me away from you and your warped thinking.

Nice way to twist the entire moniker given from an enemy as a show of respect for the tenacious fighting they did to an anti-christian slogan. Names like this aren't going to get anyone sent to hell as the original context has nothing to do with the way you twisted it. I do believe that judging others is a punishable offense by God is it not?

Back on topic, I can't believe some of the repsonses in here that I've read. Marines just need to buckle down and understand that they will get corrected. Whether it comes as a devil dog or in another form, it's going to happen. An old MSgt used to tell me when I was a LCpl that if you weren't getting your ass chewed at least once a day, you were doing something wrong. I never understood what he meant back then, but now, I think he was trying to impart the wisdom of growing thick skin and not being so sensitive to petty and trivial stuff like most of these reasons for hating being called devil dog does to some of you.

I think thicker skin will do most of these younger Marines, oopppss...I meant DEVIL DOGS good, hell, it might even fix this problem we're discussing in such detail.

[hawk71049]

That is quite possibly the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. I really hope you're not a Marine, because you have a twisted life view.

what is going on here... are you all serious... devil dog is an expression of warriorism to good faith and standing.... give me a break... hawk

[hawk71049]

As long as he provides me with the internet to keep current on world events, football, and, at a minimum, a three bedroom home with an in-ground swimming pool/hot tub and live in cook/maid, He can take me wherever he chooses...as long as he takes me away from you and your warped thinking.

Nice way to twist the entire moniker given from an enemy as a show of respect for the tenacious fighting they did to an anti-christian slogan. Names like this aren't going to get anyone sent to hell as the original context has nothing to do with the way you twisted it. I do believe that judging others is a punishable offense by God is it not?

Back on topic, I can't believe some of the repsonses in here that I've read. Marines just need to buckle down and understand that they will get corrected. Whether it comes as a devil dog or in another form, it's going to happen. An old MSgt used to tell me when I was a LCpl that if you weren't getting your ass chewed at least once a day, you were doing something wrong. I never understood what he meant back then, but now, I think he was trying to impart the wisdom of growing thick skin and not being so sensitive to petty and trivial stuff like most of these reasons for hating being called devil dog does to some of you.

I think thicker skin will do most of these younger Marines, oopppss...I meant DEVIL DOGS good, hell, it might even fix this problem we're discussing in such detail.

well said Gunny................hawk

[cerfnurf]

At least NOW I know why I get strange looks from young Marines when I go to Quantico's shiny new National Museum of the Marine Corps and say, "hey Devil Dog, thanks for" (whatever I'm thanking them for). Dang if I know when this shift happened, but I'm guessing it's probably the fault of the Marines of MY generation. I'm betting that we called peers or junior Marines "Devil Dog" instead of their name "just because," and often times we remember when we get "dressed down" vs. "praised" and if "Devil Dog's attached to it, then the negative connotation sticks.

If it IS our fault, let's FIX IT! Pass on to the friends we still have in to make sure that they TEACH their Marines that "Devil Dog" is an endearment and an honor, NOT an insult, even when it's tacked onto a "statement of correction."

If YOU want to be insulted when I call you a term that originally was created to describe our beloved Corps as full of fighters that resembled the "Hounds of Hell," then go for it. For the rest of you Devil Dogs... Semper Fi!

[Unregistered]

Just another piece of our history and tradition going down the shitter. I suppose next we will be on a first name basis. Sure can't piss off our new young Marines now can we.

Enjoy your retirement! Let the active duty guys worry about this issue.

[fmrldylthrnk]

Enjoy your retirement! Let the active duty guys worry about this issue.

And this post belongs under the "what's wrong with our corps" thread.
I'm so sick of knuckleheads mouthing off to retirees and senior SNCO's under the anonymity of the internet. Of all the services, the Marine Corps holds it heritage and history as the most sacred; it's bred into us from day one, and yet we have crap like this being said.
THAT'S WHAT WRONG WITH THE CORPS TODAY.
Where's the pride in tradition?

[fmrldylthrnk]

I just realized I used the mad face...
on the verge of losing my temper...

[Unregistered]

And this post belongs under the "what's wrong with our corps" thread.
I'm so sick of knuckleheads mouthing off to retirees and senior SNCO's under the anonymity of the internet. Of all the services, the Marine Corps holds it heritage and history as the most sacred; it's bred into us from day one, and yet we have crap like this being said.
THAT'S WHAT WRONG WITH THE CORPS TODAY.
Where's the pride in tradition?

Settle down. If someone opens their mouth, they are fair game. Also, it sounds like you’ve lost your temper. Perhaps you should look at the quote at the bottom of your posting.

[fmrldylthrnk]

Settle down. If someone opens their mouth, they are fair game. Also, it sounds like you’ve lost your temper. Perhaps you should look at the quote at the bottom of your posting.

rofl, d...a..
that's why I posted that.
:Sarcasm lost in cyberspace once again:

[Unregistered]

rofl, d...a..
that's why I posted that.
:Sarcasm lost in cyberspace once again:

I guess you’re right Devil Dog!

[Unregistered]

What the hell are recruiters recruiting these days, so many sensitive issues being brought up by young marines it rediculous. Doesnt the corps teach pride anymore, cause i know i got taugt that back in 03, boot camp Plt 2063. Devil , Devil dog, Devil nuts , who cares i loved the terms cause it ment so much more to be called that than being a %$@ bag or getting called something else and not knowing your job. I think a major reform need be done to correct all this sensitive BS, for god sakes stop recruiting rich kids who throw their family lawyers to intervine cause Pvt dumb ass, has no motivation for being a real man. The corps was ment to destroy anything that took it name in vain and save the other four useless branches from being attacked cause we know they cant help themselves, Now these days we're allowing the corps to self destruct by keeping DI marines and proper tradition from molding freakin kids to be real men.
Sure there have some mess ups with other marines so give them the "Big Chicken D" , real messed up givem the brigg, or the death needle. Im telling you we're getting to the point where MTV will be the new Marine headquarters and well have no more succesful fighting force cause we'll be just as effective as the army (pothetic). If we allow marines of any rank who have no real pride of what their appart of let a simple term like "devil dog" get you an NJP, then your swearing in when you recieved your Eagle Globe and Anchor was all a lie and you should be disgraced 4 life.

[MGySgt Penn]

The term Devil Dogs is a badge of glory for Marines. I don't know where these young Marines are getting this B.S. from. When I wanted to chew someone out, I would always call him/her a Marine. "Come here Marine". Moma's children need to go home and let the real men and women carry the banner for the Marine Corps. History and Tradition is the cornerstone of the Marines.

[Unregistered]

What the hell are recruiters recruiting these days, so many sensitive issues being brought up by young marines it rediculous. Doesnt the corps teach pride anymore, cause i know i got taugt that back in 03, boot camp Plt 2063. Devil , Devil dog, Devil nuts , who cares i loved the terms cause it ment so much more to be called that than being a %$@ bag or getting called something else and not knowing your job. I think a major reform need be done to correct all this sensitive BS, for god sakes stop recruiting rich kids who throw their family lawyers to intervine cause Pvt dumb ass, has no motivation for being a real man. The corps was ment to destroy anything that took it name in vain and save the other four useless branches from being attacked cause we know they cant help themselves, Now these days we're allowing the corps to self destruct by keeping DI marines and proper tradition from molding freakin kids to be real men.
Sure there have some mess ups with other marines so give them the "Big Chicken D" , real messed up givem the brigg, or the death needle. Im telling you we're getting to the point where MTV will be the new Marine headquarters and well have no more succesful fighting force cause we'll be just as effective as the army (pothetic). If we allow marines of any rank who have no real pride of what their appart of let a simple term like "devil dog" get you an NJP, then your swearing in when you recieved your Eagle Globe and Anchor was all a lie and you should be disgraced 4 life.

Wah Wah Wah! Do you guys need some cheese with your whine? Change strikes fear in the hearts of many, but change is inevitable. Get over it!

[Shrike]

The corps was ment to destroy anything that took it name in vain and save the other four useless branches from being attacked cause we know they cant help themselves

Bob Loblaw.

[Unregistered]

Over the history of the Corps, nick names have been established, but when was the most recent names been given too us. We are a changing Corps whether we like it or not, we are changing with the times and with the times it seems to require a new name, Yes, i know, we are all about history, and i love history, but we are changing. All our names are old, not to say thats a bad thing, but no new names have came up, and why is that?

[J-E-S-S]

it's not just the Marine Corps that is changing to be more sensitive and pc, it's the whole world. i'm 25 and when i was a kid, if i acted up, my butt would get whipped!! now you cant even give swats in school. kids are taught that they can smart off and nothing will happen to them. teachers get verbally and emotionally abused every day. it's pathetic. there is Abuse, and there is correct Punishment. laws and rules and regulations are getting too out of hand. we're losing traditions in every aspect of our lives. people dont appreciate what they have, and expect more. no one respects authority, or elders.

i'm not in the Marine Corps, my boyfriend is, but i wish i had become familiar with the Marine Corps a long time ago. i think i'm more into it than he is. all of the history and traditions and pride! i dont think you guys have to worry about any of it disappearing. you're a very strong family and you hold your traditions high. the ones who abuse it and disrespect it WON'T be the ones who re-enlist and continue on to train the next generation. i think things have probably always been the same, but with how easily the internet is accessed now, people can EASILY whine without letting anyone know who they are. just like a lot of people have annonymously left comments on here disrespecting higher ranking members. you should be ashamed of yourselves. show some respect!

and to all of you who continue to hold high your Marine Corps traditions and history, keep it up! and THANK YOU for EVERYTHING you do for us greedy Americans. some of us DO appreciate you!

[Brian]

I am a Devil Dog, and proud to be called one. Every time I hear the term directed at me or toward anyone else, I bow up with Pride for myself, those I have served with, and those whom I know will carry on the traditions of the Corps. Those who take offense to the phase now, will hopefully in their latter years realize the repsect and admiration that has been encased in that term, not only by our friends, but by our foes.

Semper Fi, Devil Dogs!
Sgt., SOI, Camp Pen.

[fmrldylthrnk]

Wah Wah Wah! Do you guys need some cheese with your whine? Change strikes fear in the hearts of many, but change is inevitable. Get over it!

Who's whining? Junior troops who don't like to be devil-dogged, or Marines who have been around the block a few times and want to hold onto the tradition and the heritage of the Corps. That's what sets us apart from the other branches--our pride in history and those who came before.

[Proud Mom]

This saying is my signature on my email and I feel it applies to the Marine Corp quite well. Please always remember your proud history.

"Cuimhnich air na daoine o'n d'thainig thu"
~Remember the men from whom you are sprung ~

[marinevet2008]

This saying is my signature on my email and I feel it applies to the Marine Corp quite well. Please always remember your proud history.

"Cuimhnich air na daoine o'n d'thainig thu"
~Remember the men from whom you are sprung ~

That's what I'm talking about. These young little punks don't want to remember where they came from, what our storied history created.

[J-E-S-S]

That's what I'm talking about. These young little punks don't want to remember where they came from, what our storied history created.

Only be careful, and watch yourselves closely so that you do not forget the things your eyes have seen or let them slip from your heart as long as you live. Teach them to your children and to their children after them.
Deuteronomy 4:8-10

[lil'mama]

It's a whole generational gap issue. Our society has pussified the younger generation. We have babied them and they are used to getting what they want when they want it and you can't say anything negative about them, whether it's constructive criticism, or heritage. Marines gaffing off SNCO's and Officers because they can and who really cares? I mean come on!! Yeah every one wants to bitch and moan and cry about Marine Corps heritage, which is part of American heritage, which the younger generation knows nothing about and doesn't really care to educate themselves on. Who's fault is that? We can't blame everything on them. We all have played a part in it, I just think it's sad that we as a society have allowed this to happen.

[YM SGT.CABRAL]

Well To Tell You The Truth The Othr Reason That Ofefnds A Retiree Is To Call Them "sir" To Me It Was A Surprise Cause I Was At An Air Show And This One Marine Came Up To Me And Was Asking Me Questions And I Just Called Him Sir Cause I Was Trained To Then He Was Yelling At Me


Now They Get Offended By Us Calling The Marines "devil Dogs" That Is Also A Big Surprise

[Unregistered]

As a former Marine I am floored at the idea that "Devil Dog" could be considered a derogatory term. Sure, it was used to get someones attention even when I got oout 4 years ago, but no one ever took it too be a bad thing. I am kind of curious as to why these "new" Marines find this term offensive. Didn't they go through boot camp and find out what the term means? Don't have they have enough respect for who they are that they would demean their own branch of the service to please their own selfish pride? The only real complaint I have with the article is why would a Marine have a girlfriend fight his battles for him? Is she a Marine to, or just a loud mouthed brat that needs to live up to what she says?

[Unregistered]

Bottom line is Devil - Dog is calling a Marine Satan's dog.
Child of Satan.
And most Marines are, if they claim that title. They will go straight to hell if they don't repent.
I can see that this argument could go on ad-nauseum. However, I would like to just ask a few questions and make a few points. Did you join the Marine Corps or Seminary? To put it in a different light:

"YOU" chose the Marine Corps, the Marine Corps did not choose you. You chose the Marine Corps why?

a). Because you wanted to be associated with the worlds most elite fighting force.
b). You wanted to hug the enemy and tell them that you forgive them for any injustice that they may have perpetrated against the free world.

Would you enroll in a college and then demand that they change the mascot because it offends you? See how that one goes over…..

I am a baby boomer. A child of the Seventies, and a borderline Hippie. But I “CHOSE” the Marine Corps and I am PROUD to be called a DEVIL DOG!!! It is a name that is STEEPED in TRADTION and HONOR!!! If you “CHOOSE “ to be associated with a Corps, there is another one that will even give you credit for Federal Service! It’s called the “Peace Corps”. Semper Fi to all. The Retired Gunny (jlandgraff@zoominternet.net)

[Unregistered]

"Devil Dog" is part of Marine Corps History, it is tradition and it is sad to see that young marines are sensitive to being called this (in my opinion) awesome nickname. All of us joined the Marines because we are the best and because of traditions like having the name "Devil Dog". I've been out of the service about 5 years and I still use it with my Marine buddies and it is something we say with pride. So to all you new Marines quit being so damn sensitive and act like you are proud of being a Marine, a "Devil Dog". If you don't like it, leave it. go join another service where they would kindly call you by your first name.

To the proud marines
Semper Fi Devil Dogs!!!!!!
SgtDiaz 99-03

[Unregistered]

USMCGRIZZ just hit it right on the head.The Marines nowadays dont understand what its all about. 99% think its a joke and think they are all back on the block. Why should I conform to them, they joined the Marine Corps, the Corps didnt join them.

I can't believe how sensitive some of these junior enlisted Marines are. I guess they haven't realized that they joined the Marine Corps and my advice to those softies is to just join another branch where they will be treated like a princess.

Sgt R.

[Unregistered]

I served 6 honorable years with the Marines, and they were by far the best of my life. To be called Devil Dog in MCT/SOI was for a reason. Your new, and they wanted to instill in you the term Devil Dog, because that is what a Marine is, was and always will be. What ever happened to the famous phrase that we Devil Dogs once used "Suck it up and Drive on". If you dont know this term, than learn it, and if you do, than do it! What is happening to the service I once loved, these NCO's or Staff NCO's either need to fix themselves or someone needs to fix this bunch of babies joining the Marines these days!!!

Semper Fi to all the real Devil Dogs out there!!!
SGT M 1997-2003
mcdowerm@aol.com

[Unregistered]

Our Marine Corps was built on the blood and sweat of those who have came befor us. Marines from our past have given the Marines of today the privlage to be called some of the things that we are called such as DEVIL DOG and LEATHER NECK. If the young Marines that are entering the Marine Corps today dont understand that then we have failed them as their leaders. More emphasis needs to be put on our history so that young Marines understand the trials and tribulations that the Marine Corps has gone through to get to where we are today.

[GruntSgt]

I served in our beloved Corps from 82-92 and I was a Devil Dog and I am proud of it. The newer generation needs to learn more about Corps History to fully understand what terms like "President's Own", "Devil Dog", "Jarhead", and "Leatherneck" really means and fully respect what others has died to defend. Remember " God, Country, and Corps"!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[fmrldylthrnk]

Okay...I think we've all said the same thing in 50 different ways. After the email from the Commandant I'd say that "devil dog" will not be disappearing.

[J-E-S-S]

I would just like to compliment the Drill Instructors at MCRD San Diego. James (my bf) graduated this past october and he was VERY proud to be called Devil Dog and any other name the Marines have inherited along the way. The Drill Instructors did a fabulous job of teaching the Marine Corps history! on family day James took us all through the museum on base and explained in VAST detail every display in the entire place. he was spewing with pride. i would assume that the ones complaining make up a very very small majority of Marines.

[Unregistered]

Okay...I think we've all said the same thing in 50 different ways. After the email from the Commandant I'd say that "devil dog" will not be disappearing.
I have to admit that I didn't go through all the postings before I started my rant. I now see that what I wrote is similar to several other postings. However, I was curious to read what the CMC had to say. After reviewing all of the postings (mostly by name) I didn't see anything from the CMC? Could you please either point me in the right direction or forward it to me? Semper Fi! The Retired Gunny (jlandgraff@zoominternet.net)

[Unregistered]

It's funny, we hear "the Marine Corps is getting soft". "Kinder, gentler corps". But at no other point in US history has the Marine Corps ever been as efficient as they are now. People should still be corrected. But the "meaner, harder" corps - ie. hazing, beating down new boots, pushing chevrons on - they're not necessary, nor were they ever necessary because it hasn't slowed the corps down one bit in still only getting deadlier and more efficient..

I had my mosquito wing PFC chevrons pinned on at Parris Island by my heavy, contrary to the "hazing" policy and it was one of the most rewarding experiences there. I wished my Lance Corporal chevrons would have been pinned on by my now peers. I hope that when I get my blood stripe that I am made to earn it. These little things in the Corps mean a lot to Marines. Yes there are abuses, but men sign up to be Marines and to become part of that great tradition. They should start savoring that tradition and embracing it.

--Lcpl Fortin

[Unregistered]

I just had a fellow Devil Dog that I work with in the office point this article out to me. I was stunned to hear that these young Marines today take Devil Dog as a derogatory statement. I served in the Corp from 1993 to 1997 and had my fair share of tongue thrashings. I was always proud and will remain proud of the name Devil Dog. The hard chargers that came before and put their life on the line in those battles, who am I to argue with them, especially a DOUBLE MEDAL OF HONOR recipient. These young Marines need to stop reading into things so much. We are Marines, the few the proud. We are not the Air force that gets steak and eggs, not the Army that needs to give a bonus to get you to join...WE ARE MARINES DAMNIT...We all earned that right once we graduated from boot camp....we joined because we respect our fellow Marines, Marines that served before us...How many other branch's can say they had Chesty Puller...Dan Daily...Smedly Butler..Come on Marines...Devil Dog is no different than saying hard charge, jarhead, leatherneck...enjoy your time in and respect the history......

[Unregistered]

What's next? Young-blood Marines start taking offense at the name 'Marine', because some Senior NCO, says "Hey, Marine!"
My father, who served in the Navy, and later the Army, has locked up quite a few young Marines' heels on several occasions, sor simple matters like not wearing a cover while in uniform or not wearing the appropriate clothing out of uniform. He's the son of a Devildog, his father served on Iwo Jima, Guadalcanal, and a few other little islands in the Pacific. I served in the Marines myself, and I think my father is more proud of that fact than even I was.
If ever a young lady, or young Marine challenged me on calling a Marine a Devildog, I'd have to think I'd lock up his/her heels the same way. I can still bellow like a DI, and the hand movements do go away. Things like this make me think I'm now part of The Old Corps.

Scott

[Unregistered]

It is truly a tough pill to swallow, to even think that marines see or think this term in a negative light. I could not understand why even to this day. Devil Dog is a term that is and should be near and dear to your heart. DEVIL DOG! true may sound like you did something bad and maybe you did instead of saying Jones dont screw it up again, we can say," Devil Dog what the hell? You know better then that fix yourself. But like they say," If marines arent complaining or destorying something then we have a problem so DEVIL DOGS just go destroy something or start complaining about how they dont allow you on myspace at work anylonger!"

[vonbildhofen]

You ruined it yourself by using it so often that it became just as retarded as the army caling eachother whoha's all the time. SO GET WITH THE PROGRAM OLD SCHOOL. UR CORPS JOINED IN A TIME OF PEACE AND RUINED IT FOR MY GENERATION

Holy mother of Jesus, please have mercy on my soul for what I am about to say. My generation ruined the term for YOUR generation?!?! Where do you get off saying something like that? That sounds reminiscent of the 60's - 'burn your bras', 'dodge the draft', 'run to Canada', 'turn on and tune out' 'spit on the babykiller' kind of garbage that one generation used to blamed another for the faults of American society.
Now, you're telling me that wet-behind the ears noobs right out of boot get to tell me I can't use a term that has held honor and distinction for 90 years, because you take offense at the term? Give me a break. That is the most assinine statement I have ever heard!
Did any of your DIs, NCOs, SNCOs, or officers talk about "The 10%" around you? Anyone? Let me refreseh some memories around here. It takes 10% of a population to define the public's perception of that population. Ever hear anyone refer to marines as 'killers' or 'rapists' or 'abusive spouses'? That's because 10% or less of them fall into that category. But, that does not mean that ALL Marines fall into those descriptions.
How many of you have heard anyone state that all Marines are Christian, church-going, family-oriented, community-sponsoring individuals? I guarantee, it isn't many, no matter how many of us actually are ALL of those things. So, you 10% who ar offended by the term Devildog, teufelhunden, etc because you got yelled at by a superior need to realise, you are just 10%. You do not define the entirely of the Corps. And this 'generation X is to blame for everything wrong with Generation Y' garbage is the same thing we've all been hearing for decades. No one wants to take responsibility for their own mistakes or actions. If you walk on the Grass at 29 Palms you better expect to be corrected. If you screw up in front of other Marines you better expect to be corrected. And if that other Marine doesn't know your name or rank when they grab your attention, you better expect to be called Devildog, Jarhead, Gyrene, Marine, Leatherneck, or something else. Be happy they didn't call you "sh__-bird", "f___-up", or something worse. Otherwise, I think we need to institute a policy of Baby Blue uniforms for all non-hackers in my beloved Corps.
That is all I have to say about that.

Scott
89-93

[Unregistered]

hey i was marine from 74-79 never call a devil dog maybe boot but sr or staff nco s us by last name or rank but in boot camp in those day we knew how to read and we had marine corps history class,s we were call jarhead or grunt back in the day lol am old school and if were a screw up they call you a shit brid

[Unregistered]

shit brid


What's a shit brid?

[CallOnMe]

I think this discussion is indicative of a shift in the country that can be seen in homes every where. The "Forget where you came from and try to figure out where your going" mentality is born. In my opinion its a bad way to be.

[Floridaboy]

Devil Dog here from 1982-1986, 1987-1989, 1991

Will always be one FOREVER...that's something NOBODY can take from me ever. EFF the PC crowd!!!

[SGT101]

Devil Dogs,

Such Forums and front covers of Marine Times stating what they like or dont like to be called is just a plain waste of time and media. Why dont you look over the internet at this Marine "Sgt Carmelo Rodriguez" and see if it dosent anger you as well place some tears on your eyes. There are better things we should be focusing on and fighting for survival no longer applies in a war zone but walking into medical as well.

[Wounded Warrior 1812]

Ahh the name " Devil Dog" givin by the Germans in Belleau Wood. Once givin you say "Devil Dog" and people military or not know who your talking about and gave the upmost respect and honor. Now Im hearing that its now being used as a derogatory term for young devil dogs. I myself have been in for only 5 years in July and I dont agree as it being a negative thing I have all the pride in the world of the things I have accomplished. But do I see the reason for this.... absolutely. In my opinion when a young Marine heres Hey Devil Dog it usually means that there in trouble or something along those lines. Also it seems that the higher ranking call you out on it but if you were to see somebody of a higher rank messed up or not doing something appropriate it seems to the newer Marines that it would be out of the question to refer them as Devil Dog. Im sorry but the last time I checked that Devil Dog was a term for ALL MARINES not just junior Marines. Im saying from my experience and from what I have seen when somebody gets called Devil Dog it usually ends with something negative so the Marines only have this to go on and its a rarity to hear something positive after being called Devil Dog. But to end this I just think that when being called Devil Dog it should be more used as a positive thing rather than something negative and I think once this happens people will start to take more pride in the name of "DEVIL DOG".
-Chris Gray
-WWB-East

[The Universal Curmudgeon_guest]

Ahh the name " Devil Dog" givin by the Germans in Belleau Wood. Actually there is no verifiable record that the Germans ever used the term.

Not only that, but the Germans would never have used the term "Teufel Hund" to mean "Dogs of the Devil".

There is, however, pretty strong evidence that it was a non-German speaking American reporter who invented the term.

That being said, the USMC has earned the right to it - and not when it is used in a derogatory manner.

[KillerPav]

Since when did we care what a junoir Marine thought? When I was a troop I tried to do everything right so I would not get yelled at, it wasnt the Devil Dog remark it was the chewing I would get for screwing up. Why are we even having this discussion. When did leaders start caring what they think of anything. Its as simple as correct yourself or I WILL and thats it. It doesnt matter what comes After the "Hey" part, it could be Marine, Killer, Warrior, they all mean the same thing, fix yourself your wrong. When we start listening to what they think, they stop listening to us and before you know it, they dont talk at parade rest, they dont say the rank, they dont even give you a proper greating when you walkk by which is what we have now because we started caring! Let it go! Let one snap at the fact that he or she doesnt like the term, that Devil Dog will be out back digging a hole in the dirt like a dog!

[U_GOT_TO_BE_KIDDING]

No Devil Dog..no Tattoos..pretty soon we will be polished enough to pass for Air Force. Lets hear it for politicall-correct leadership! I DO NOT agree with Marines using a honorable term such as Devil Dog to disrespect junior Marines. They are the ones responsilble for the demise of "esprit de corps" by destroying our beloved traditions. When I was in you just said "Marine" if you wanted to get their attention....or you called them by rank or rank and name. How difficult is that?

You got it man! You hit it right on the head! Whats next!? Good thing is we will at least be able to wear the "new running suit" out on liberty! thats nice!! Why is this even being talked about? Can't we talk about something else like, when we are going to be able to pass down the GI BILL to familys, or something more worth reading!?

[divitdivit]

Devil Dogs,

Such Forums and front covers of Marine Times stating what they like or dont like to be called is just a plain waste of time and media. Why dont you look over the internet at this Marine "Sgt Carmelo Rodriguez" and see if it dosent anger you as well place some tears on your eyes. There are better things we should be focusing on and fighting for survival no longer applies in a war zone but walking into medical as well.

ITA. Hoorah.

[SG29]

First of all, to all the new marines who get offended by being harassed, ass-chewed, told to do their job instead of being politely asked, expected to keep their head held high, and abide by a standard set forth by many generations, WHO THE HELL DO YOU THINK YOU ARE??? You are a Marine, a leatherneck, a FREAKING DEVIL DOG!!! If this was not what you expected or wanted then so be it, do your time honorably then get the hell out to whatever cushy job awaits you on the other side. But while you're here, note that this is a place of tact, tradition, professionalism, and pride! Too many marines have gotten into their head that the Marine Corps is a job. How about reevaluating yourself and get it into your thick domes that the Marine Corps is a lifestyle! Brought up by men who have done more in their lifetimes then most of us will ever get the chance to do in ours. You want things to change then do your time, come up through the ranks and let your experiences dictate how you are as a senior marine. Though if you choose not to then how bout a can of shut the f*ck up!!! The corps has a mission and this mission is to fight wars, help people across the world, and to keep our own people safe in America. If you get yelled at, suck it up. It's to your benefit and by locking people on to jump at orders impulsively and getting your assed chewed when you do things wrong, it keeps you alive in combat situations and gets the Corps the gear, missions, and daily duties done as soon as possible. This Marine Corps was never made to work for you, you VOLUNTARILY pledged yourself to it to do whatever it needed you to do. So tell me, would you get offended if someone called you a Marine during an ass-chewing? Cuz last i knew Marine and Devil Dog were one in the same... As for the DEVIL DOG in the last issue who requested the Marine Corps to begin a simpler, nicer, p*ssified first name policy... you my friend must have walked into the wrong recruiting office. Whether you are getting your ass handed to you or praised for doing something right, you are a Devil Dog and if you get called one in the process of either... that is what you are! Be proud of it! Grab whatever you got between your legs (both male and female types alike) and remove your head from your ass! This is my Marine Corps and I'll be damned if you spend your time trying to kill everything it stands for!!!

[highnoon]

SgtMaj of the Marine Corps will need to address this to all Marines. We know we shouldn't use words to belittle but it was the same when I was in. I my self am very proud to be called "Devil Dog", "Leather Neck", or "Marine", but it's all in the way speaker uses the terms.

When chewing out a Marine there should be only one way to do it. Rank Lastname. If you don't know who it is then STOP and ask.

Semper Fi , Devil Dogs... Don't political nice take away a Proud History

[vonbildhofen]

Not only that, but the Germans would never have used the term "Teufel Hund" to mean "Dogs of the Devil".
.
The first time I heard the term was when I was in Germany - I was 16, and the family I was living with used the term teufelhunde all the time - accompanied with their index fingers raised in the air. Their dog was a little dachshund that got into trouble all the time. When I asked what the term meant, the answer was 'devil dog'. Further defined, they told me it specifically referred to 'a dog that was very troublesome' - 'a dog that is always causing them trouble'. There may have been around 70 years between the 1st World War and when I heard the term, but I'm pretty sure they would have used the term even then - I can even imagine the germans at that time thinking the Marines were a troublesome nuisance at the very least...

[The Universal Curmudgeon_guest]

The first time I heard the term was when I was in Germany - I was 16, and the family I was living with used the term teufelhunde all the time - accompanied with their index fingers raised in the air. Their dog was a little dachshund that got into trouble all the time. When I asked what the term meant, the answer was 'devil dog'. Further defined, they told me it specifically referred to 'a dog that was very troublesome' - 'a dog that is always causing them trouble'. There may have been around 70 years between the 1st World War and when I heard the term, but I'm pretty sure they would have used the term even then - I can even imagine the germans at that time thinking the Marines were a troublesome nuisance at the very least...Teufelhund is a singular form and not a plural. Teufelshunde is the plural. For a German to say Die Marines sind Teufelhund means that "The Marines (plural) are a Devil's dog (singular)."

In any event, the origin of the phrase is NOT anything that can be traced to the German Army, but it can be traced to an American newspaper.

That being said, if the Germans didn't call the Marines Teufelhunde they should have, so the Marines should wear the term with the original level of pride that occassioned it.

[MACHINE666]

"Teufelhunden" I believe is the correct plural spelling for Devil Dogs. I am currently taking a German 401 class and can double-check with my teacher tonight, who is a German national with an excellent command of the English vocabulary. Either way I hope it would encourage more people to learn about Germany and its rich history, and not focus so much on just a phrase or the idiot who mislead them for 12 years. Seems that's all the Germans are remember for nowadays by the American media.

:(

[CplH5811]

I personally do not see the problem as Marines getting Devil Dogged. It's the fact that it is constantly used in a derogitory manner. I know this has been said over and over but there are a few that don't understand this. I have had a couple occasions where I have been DD'd for my accomplishments. But, there have been over 10 times more instances where it is a negative tone. Marine works just as well when trying to get someones attention. The problem lies with those of us that use it in the negative way. I am sure that if we used the term jar head, it would be more suitable. Because obviously, you are having a temporary lapse in judgement A.K.A. "brain fart". In which case, you head was momentarily empty. Now, I have Devil Dogged someone that was jacked up and it got their attention. However, taking a term that embodies our fighting spirit and twisting it, unintentionally of course, into a bad label causes exactly what we are seeing now. And, I feel that if we as leaders are going to correct this, we all need to understand that it is a problem and correct it as soon as possible. I am not saying that we need to coddle Junior Marines and hold their hand, but understand what is going on.

[Lance Criminal 03]

I couldn't believe all the responses from this article about the term "Devil Dog" being derogatory. Sure you get called it before you get a butt chewing, but think about traditions. Even back at bootcamp it was harped about how the Marine Corps is all about traditions, and now it's considered hazing. Whats next, you can't read LeJeune's birthday message because you have to stand in formation to listen to it. I'm a junior enlisted Marine myself and have been called "Devil Dog" plenty of times, and i find it appaulling when people are offended by it. That title was earned and you needed some tough skin to get, now the tough skin is gone because you're oer with bootcamp. Grow up, be a man or woman, and take it with a grain of salt. LONG LIVE DEVIL DOG!

[spook]

The term "devil Dog" has not been used the correct way by some NCO's and StaffNCO's. The term Devil Dog was being used negatively by some leaders before they corrected someone or while chewing someone’s rear end. However, it is our fault by not correcting that deficiency before it escalated. The new Corps aka today's junior Marines may never even use the term again and the beloved tradition might fade away and become a tale. It is up to us NCO's and Staff NCO's to fix this problem and keep the Marine Corps tradition the way it is supposed to be kept.

In reply to the Staff NCO that stated that if a LCpl would yell at him, that one would be going to the hospital and it wouldn't be him. Think about it!

If you would risk your career over a LCpl, then do it. However, Any SNCO or NCO that assaults a junior Marine and puts him in the hospital would be charged to the fullest extent of the UCMJ. Then both of them will be junior Marines!

S/F
Spook

[Cpl.Morin/5831MCASMiramar]

I just wanted to say how sad it is that not one NCO or junior Marine was printed in the May 12th edition of Marine Corps Times defending the tradition of Devil Dog. Why is it that only E-7's or higher had anything to say about the disrespect that was displayed on the cover, or the ridiculous comments from Marines who are too scared to print their ranks and names, but could run their mouths about our traditions. It breaks my heart to see my own peers and troops complain and whine about being called a Devil Dog. You should all be proud as hell to have that name. As a Corporal in the Marine Corps with only 4 years in, I have been called a Devil Dog just like you all. And not once did I think in my head that I was offended or that it was wrong in anyway. It is just a part of who I am. Just like being called a Marine. Is that what's next? Are all the young Marines going to resent being called a Marine? Is that going to be on the next issue of the Marine Corps Times? Shame on all of you NCO's who didn't defend our traditions. It shouldn't just be left to the "old timers" to speak up. You're a damn NCO. Act like it.

Cpl. Amanda Morin

[commonsense101]

I got out Dec of 2006 and I have a bumper sticker on my car that says devildog and I display it proudly!!!!! My peers and I constantly called each other devildog and I never saw anything wrong with the term . In bootcamp we went over the history on where the term "devildog" was derived from about 50 million times. I've always considered it an honor..nothing less. I didn't read the article on the issue so does anyone know why individuals feel it's a negative statement????

[Gunny_2862]

Amen Cpl Morin....that was very well put.

[SSgtB1990]

Has anyone read this week's responses to the Devildog story? There's a letter from a Gunny about the picture that was printed on the cover that week that is stinking hilarious. I'm still cracking up over it.

[Unregistered]

I can't begin to understand what the problem is. I don't need a moniker or nickname to be content with who and what I am. If it stays or goes, oh well. It is the Staff NCO's that ruined this tradition, not the junior troops. They can fix and correct their own mess.

I read it a while back from someone else and I'll repeat it, because it is absolutely true. What would happen if a Lance Corporal were to go walking around and greet every SNCO and up with an "Oorah, Devil Dog!" This is in a positive and motivating tone, too!

Don't even try to justify it, because its the same thing. The junior troop would get the raised eyebrows and the "Who is this guy?" look from the SNCO. There would be the butt-chewing of a lifetime. If junior Marines use the ranks of those senior, then the seniors can repay the courtesy.

[SG29]

Are you damn kidding me??? I'd love to see you walk up to a MGySgt and call out "Oorah, Marine!!!" I hope to GOD you would get your fair share of a healthy ass chewing! Since when does a less senior Marine rate to call senior enlisted by such a generic term? Are we the damn Army now who calls E-5 thru E-7 by one group name of "Sgt"? No these guys have earned their rank and that is to be respected by all! Marines have always taken pride with that fact. I'm tired of hearing this excuse. No one in the past would ever try to throw this into a debate but nowadays all the new marines have absolutely no respect for their senior personnell. And what the hell gives you the right as a LCpl in the Marine Corps to choose who and when you give your respects!?! We're all marines and I wear the name "Devil Dog" with pride. But i also wear a rank and when you address me you address me as such, as do I with my seniors. So quit passing the buck of blame onto everybody else and take the responsibility onto yourself. YOU are the one who carries the name of a Marine and all it's entities. And you will be the one responsible for carrying the MC on your shoulders in the future. Own up to the challenge and grow up!

"Those who stand for nothing fall for anything." ~Alexander Hamilton

[wzgriffith]

While I don't like how the term is deemed negative now, I can kind of understand why. If you use a term in the nagative sense enough times, like devil dog, it's going to have a ban connatation. Most people only hear the phrase right before an ass chewing. Its simple psycology, like Pavlov's dogs salivation at the sound of a bell, junior Marines cringe at the uttering of the phrase "Devil Dog."

[BABYGIRL76]

Cpl Morin,

That was an awesome post. It was direct and to the point.

-SSgt Herrera, M.

[Unregistered]

In reply to the Staff NCO that stated that if a LCpl would yell at him, that one would be going to the hospital and it wouldn't be him. Think about it!



for anyone speaking to people ranking less than them.

RANK DOES NOT EQUAL PHYSICAL PROWESS.

I could be a private and you could be a gunny. your rank means nothing when you get in a fight. it's not like a sticker on a rice rocket or a tattoo on a grunt. it means NOTHING.

so all you Staff NCO's who think your rank means something in the physical department. BRING IT.

[AYF1059]

Cpl Morin,

Be careful, the Commandant might read that post and put you in charge of Public Affairs!! Good job.

Cpl Anderson 2001-2005

[SSgtAllen3381]

Cpl Morin,

Be careful, the Commandant might read that post and put you in charge of Public Affairs!! Good job.

Cpl Anderson 2001-2005

No he won't, she has yet to be "issued" her new set of P.T. gear!!!

[notamotogrunt]

I would like to start out by saying that the nickname is great. Marines are know for what they have done in combat and this nickname is a result of that. However, when it is used towards me by some POG a** marine and he is trying to correct me on something (usually something dumb) such as where my boots are bloused I want to choke the hell outta him. Esspecially when he says something to the effect of "Is that how your supposed to be devil dog?" That pisses me off for a couple reasons. The main one is Im pretty sure it wasnt admin, motor T, legal service, CLB, embark, so on and so forth, marines that earned the name Devil dog. So in response to that 08 guy who posted a while back saying "get over it you boot devil dogs" I have a newsflash for him, Im 99% sure he is still a boot himself whos never been outside the wire and if he has then not in serious combat.
This cracks me up honestly. The only time I have ever refered to a marine as a devil dog has been with my buddies (fellow lance criminals) in a joking and sarcastic manner. Couple of reasons for that.
Whenever we hear somebody yell at us and it starts with "HEY DEVIL DOG" you know the guy is a complete moat dog but has probably never honestly done a thing except work in his POG shop and pick up rank being blessed by MOS.
Other times we hear it are in a false motavating voice from our NCO SNCOs for instance "Hey listen up DEVIL DOGS" during formation or something.
Now the rare exception has come from a few SNCOs towards me. When I revcieved a purple heart a SgtMaj said congrats devil dog. That to me was not degrading but actually made me proud.
My bottom line is this. The name aint bad but needs to be changed how and how often it is used.

P.S. Ive seen a SNCO take a pansy of a PFC and smash his head into a wall to the point where he needed stiches and there were minor reporcussions. The guy is still a SNCO of the same rank.
I also had one of my good friends experience something similar. A gunny got in his face and called him a dumbf@@@ for something that my friend had no control over. MY buddy says hey gunny I didnt do anything wrong and tried to explain it and the gunny shoved him....long story short the gunny is missing a few teeth and his nose is crooked for life and my buddy is still the same rank he was. Rockers dont mean you can rock. Dont forget it.

[SGT6124]

Very well said Former_Marine_23. Atleast POG's are good for chow if nothing else.

[Sgt D]

No he won't, she has yet to be "issued" her new set of P.T. gear!!!

SSgt, your'e on Lejeune, right? When are we getting those new running suits? It goes by base, right?

[SSgtAllen3381]

SSgt, your'e on Lejeune, right? When are we getting those new running suits? It goes by base, right?


Yes, I'm on LeJeune, but here is the latest news that I've found:

http://blog.militaryuniformgouge.com/2008/02/18/new-marine-corps-running-suit-update.aspx

[notamotogrunt]

That dude was def like a two and a half year sgt who probably had 1 or 2 close calls with IDF while in Iraq so he thinks he KNOWS what combat is like. what a pog. Tell you what you go do what we do for a dployment or 2 then come back to the rear and get devil dogged by someone whos done nothing and see how u react. I guess that would be hard for you to do though, cause you were so motovated and proud to be a devil dog that you got out. Semper stupid dude. Jus go back to being a civilian.
PS pretty sure I carried with me everything I used while I was deployed on the way over there (except ammo), MREs were dropped from an Air Force helo as was water, so yea the marine corps could win a war without the pogs. All that being said, you looked right past what I wrote before and skipped strait to being butthurt because I used the term pog and you have gone way off the topic of this thread.

[Lone_NCO]

Damn, cant we all just get along? Somebodys always gettin butthurt on these forums, some of you guys need to relax. In the defense of POGS i'm an admin, but i was sent to iraq as security, hit some IEDs took some small arms fire, not really a big deal compared to kickin down doors patroling through cities all day, but i still got mad at marines who never deployed who tried to devil dog me.

On the opposite end we as Marines are supposed to police our own, NCOs are supposed to lead by example and all that other good stuff. So regardless of wether or not a Marine has been to combat or been through anything they wear chevrons and a name tape because thats all they should need. Promotion warrants dont say only listen to those who have more deployment time then you, and I wish a junior marine would get disrespectful if i tried to correct him, regardless of what the hell he's been through and when you/ if your not already, become an NCO do you think your gonna give a damn what that junior Marines been through? (all angry grunts) Think about that

On topic though, i've heard devil dog used in many ways, junior Marines who are being offended need to suck it up and senior Marines who use it solely in a negative way need to correct themselves. I dont even think this should even be a topic of disscussion, it shouldnt even be an issue. Softer, kinder, gentler?

[SGT6124]

That dude was def like a two and a half year sgt who probably had 1 or 2 close calls with IDF while in Iraq so he thinks he KNOWS what combat is like. what a pog. Tell you what you go do what we do for a dployment or 2 then come back to the rear and get devil dogged by someone whos done nothing and see how u react. I guess that would be hard for you to do though, cause you were so motovated and proud to be a devil dog that you got out. Semper stupid dude. Jus go back to being a civilian.
PS pretty sure I carried with me everything I used while I was deployed on the way over there (except ammo), MREs were dropped from an Air Force helo as was water, so yea the marine corps could win a war without the pogs. All that being said, you looked right past what I wrote before and skipped strait to being butthurt because I used the term pog and you have gone way off the topic of this thread.

Hey Marine, do you proofread what you write? You said you don't need pogs to win a war but who dropped you off food and water? Air Force helos? Wow, those crew chiefs and pilots are pogs, and without that food, you wouldn't last long. One more thing, that must have been one hell of a hump from where you are stationed over to Iraq.....all those pogs who took a boat or flew over there must be rediculous.

[Lone_NCO]

That article was the reason I learned about that this forum and I was about to go off, so i'm glad another NCO beat me to it. Kudos to you Cpl Morin, thats what we are supposed to do

[Former_Marine_23]

That dude was def like a two and a half year sgt who probably had 1 or 2 close calls with IDF while in Iraq so he thinks he KNOWS what combat is like. what a pog. Tell you what you go do what we do for a dployment or 2 then come back to the rear and get devil dogged by someone whos done nothing and see how u react. I guess that would be hard for you to do though, cause you were so motovated and proud to be a devil dog that you got out. Semper stupid dude. Jus go back to being a civilian.
PS pretty sure I carried with me everything I used while I was deployed on the way over there (except ammo), MREs were dropped from an Air Force helo as was water, so yea the marine corps could win a war without the pogs. All that being said, you looked right past what I wrote before and skipped strait to being butthurt because I used the term pog and you have gone way off the topic of this thread.

You're right, I had one or two close calls with IDF so I think I know what combat is. I was actually an 0231/Intel Analyst but as luck would have it, I was attached to one of our HET's which as you know being a grunt, we augment the Infantry Bn, go on raids, kick down doors, are in it with the grunts. Now in 2004 when I was in Fallujah, we took over 300 rounds of IDF in 6 months. 2005 when I was with 1/5, Ramadi was a shit hole, 2006 when I was with 3/8, Ramadi was the worst I had seen it and we were averaging 25-30 attacks a day. 2007 was better with almost no attacks which was weird but I wasn't complaining. Just because I was fortunate enough not to get a purple heart like you doesn't mean I haven't seen combat. My stack of medals and ribbons would suggest otherwise and since I've probably seen more time in combat than you have in the Marine Corps Lance Corporal, you might want to chose your words more carefully about us POG's out there. I'm pretty sure without the intel guys like me provided you, you'd get to play "clean the 50. Cal" and "Let's fill sandbags" the whole deployment.

[uconn]

The first time I saw my fiancee's tattoo I wondered why he had a damm dog on his arm. Once he explained the history behind it I fell in love with the symbolism. You should all be proud of your history. If you had wanted something else you should have joined one of the other branches of the military. If you are being called a devil dog in a negative way, well, maybe you should look at your behavior and stop doing what it was that got you called out.
As for the whole grunt vs pog thing. Let me just say this: I'm a nurse (which is basically the grunt of the medical world) You know the first person I make friends with when I've gone to new units? The unit clerks, without them I would never, I repeat never be able to get my job done. We all have our jobs to do. Be proud of yours, but don't think it makes you better than anyone else.

[notamotogrunt]

Yup ur right. My main point was most junior marines dont like being called devil dog because it seems interchangeable with "hey boot" and a lot of jr marines are def not boots anymore. That is the point I am trying to make.

[USMC/SSGT]

this is all silly talk. i am sure every Marine who has commented or read this post remembers the very first time that they were ever called "Devil Dog" and felt happier then a pig in sh*t to finally be able to earn the brand of such a title that has been passed on for generations regardless of rank, race, creed or mos. i think that it is absolutely shameful that this new generation of punk Marines think that being "DD" is such a bad thing, how about instead of being Devil Dogged they get called retards or sh*t bags because obviously if they are getting "lifed" then they have messed up in some way or another.
to all you motivators that think you are too tough to recieve a good ol ass rippin from a "pog" need to suck that up too! if you are looking for a good old fashion slap in the mouth or a grunt style ass whoopin go ahead and roll your eyes or smart off to me and your gonna wonder if i am a grunt! every Marine who wears the uniform goes everywhere that the Marine Corps sends them whether it be in an air conditioned office or the biggest hole in the earth, it doesnt matter, we all serve the same Corps!

rah!

[dgeezy]

Honestly we should'nt even be called Devil Dogs anymore.... we should switch to Devil FROGS!!! I mean, we wear green all the time, and plus were amphibious! So why not???

[d3v1ld0g]

I would like to start out by saying that the nickname is great. Marines are know for what they have done in combat and this nickname is a result of that. However, when it is used towards me by some POG a** marine and he is trying to correct me on something (usually something dumb) such as where my boots are bloused I want to choke the hell outta him. Esspecially when he says something to the effect of "Is that how your supposed to be devil dog?" That pisses me off for a couple reasons. The main one is Im pretty sure it wasnt admin, motor T, legal service, CLB, embark, so on and so forth, marines that earned the name Devil dog. So in response to that 08 guy who posted a while back saying "get over it you boot devil dogs" I have a newsflash for him, Im 99% sure he is still a boot himself whos never been outside the wire and if he has then not in serious combat.
This cracks me up honestly. The only time I have ever refered to a marine as a devil dog has been with my buddies (fellow lance criminals) in a joking and sarcastic manner. Couple of reasons for that.
Whenever we hear somebody yell at us and it starts with "HEY DEVIL DOG" you know the guy is a complete moat dog but has probably never honestly done a thing except work in his POG shop and pick up rank being blessed by MOS.
Other times we hear it are in a false motavating voice from our NCO SNCOs for instance "Hey listen up DEVIL DOGS" during formation or something.
Now the rare exception has come from a few SNCOs towards me. When I revcieved a purple heart a SgtMaj said congrats devil dog. That to me was not degrading but actually made me proud.
My bottom line is this. The name aint bad but needs to be changed how and how often it is used.

P.S. Ive seen a SNCO take a pansy of a PFC and smash his head into a wall to the point where he needed stiches and there were minor reporcussions. The guy is still a SNCO of the same rank.
I also had one of my good friends experience something similar. A gunny got in his face and called him a dumbf@@@ for something that my friend had no control over. MY buddy says hey gunny I didnt do anything wrong and tried to explain it and the gunny shoved him....long story short the gunny is missing a few teeth and his nose is crooked for life and my buddy is still the same rank he was. Rockers dont mean you can rock. Dont forget it.

You think that your just a bad a** huh? So when your rifle breaks, or your NVG's go out, you think your still a bad ass. NO! If it were not for us "POG's" you would just be a dude standing in a firefight with his thumb up his a**! I bet if you dont get payed on time youd be pissed too, and all that bad ass would be whining to his admin clerk to fix it. All Marines regardless of MOS earned their title. We all support each other in one way or another. Why are we all bickering like this? We are Marines, and we are all supposed to be a family. No matter what MOS you are, no matter the rank. We all bleed the same color, we all put on our trousers one leg at a time. I do agree that we should pay our respects to our leaders, and give them the dignity they deserve. Chances are, they went through the same sh** we did when they were junior. When you get your a** chewed, its not because they hate you, its becasue they want you to succeed and sometimes a lil chewing of the rear area is what you need. I am proud to be called a "devildog" wether it be in an a** chewing, or a postive recognition. ITS WHAT I AM !! You think just because you graduated bootcamp that your go to go, and you know whats up? Everybody has to do their time, eventually youll be the a** chewing, and not the recieving end. You tired of the way things run? Do your time, pick up rank and then run sh** the way you want to. As for now do what your told, take your chewings as experience and keep hard charging.


S/F
LCPL Devildog :D

[SGT6124]

Good post motivator!

[notamotogrunt]

Pretty easy to stay moto in an ac building behind a cpu all day. Look dude. I have said that I think the nickname is great but prime example here. Lets say you work @ DFAC and I come down there to bitch about my pay. On the way into the building your little brown nose had picked up and was outside for some reason and yelled "HEY DEVIL DOG, fix those boot blouses!!!" Im gonna look at you make a puking noise and keep on walking. Now if you said "Hey man, your boots are bloused a little low." Im probably still not gonna fix um but I would probably say hey thats where I like um sorry (I might even add a cpl to that if I dont think your a complete nut sack). Thats the point I am trying to make.

[notamotogrunt]

Im a marine and I know about the whole history of the devil dog thing. I just dont like getting devil dogged. Its annoying.

[SGT6124]

[QUOTE=notamotogrunt;102185} Im probably still not gonna fix um but I would probably say hey thats where I like um sorry (I might even add a cpl to that if I dont think your a complete nut sack). Thats the point I am trying to make.[/QUOTE]

This is what we are talking about, you are one of the young bucks messing this up for everyone. Keep on dragging our name through the mud and see how the MC turns out in a few years. I freakin' dare you to walk past an NCO after they have corrected you and you blow them off and I am around....post up little soldier. Devil Dog stands for a whole lot that I think you have forgotten since bootcamp about 3 months ago. Since you are a "ground pounder" this name should means even more to you, but maybe you are just to ignorant to notice that.

[notamotogrunt]

whatever hardcore. Ur a pog who probably loves to chew ass. What are you gonna do stop me and yell at me, ok cool. Been through that before it dont really bother me. So all that comes from that is you get to yell and make a scene and feel like tommy tuff nutts and I go on not caring and you become the butt of every joke for my company for like the next week. ohh rah hard charger. I have told yo uI like the nickname devil dog for a marine but it is over used and used the wrong way.

[SGT6124]

whatever hardcore. Ur a pog who probably loves to chew ass. What are you gonna do stop me and yell at me, ok cool. Been through that before it dont really bother me. So all that comes from that is you get to yell and make a scene and feel like tommy tuff nutts and I go on not caring and you become the butt of every joke for my company for like the next week. ohh rah hard charger. I have told yo uI like the nickname devil dog for a marine but it is over used and used the wrong way.

Little devil dog, did you hear me say I would chew your ass? Nah, I like making you learn a lesson, not turning me off like a radio after my opening sentence. Yelling only gets you so far with a disrespectful Marine such as your self. Sometimes they need to be made examples to other disrespectful Marines. Maybe they will get the picture and straighten up. You can always give those who use the nickname incorrectly a Corps Values class and correct them of their mistake, or maybe you will leave that up to us hard chargers to do your job again as well.

[notamotogrunt]

how would you make me learn a lesson. Im just gonna stand there when you get pissed, give you a blank stare and say yes no aye "appropriate rank" then go back to my own little world

[SGT6124]

how would you make me learn a lesson. Im just gonna stand there when you get pissed, give you a blank stare and say yes no aye "appropriate rank" then go back to my own little world
You talk a great game on the internet in a forum, but I bet you wouldn't be this way posted up with me and your First Sergeant now would you? I didn't think so.

[SGT6124]

Its' only annoying if it's used in the wrong context.

[SGT6124]

So, you are saying you would respect me infront of your First Sergeant, but not one on one? You have some issues that need resolving.

[notamotogrunt]

I agree with you

[notamotogrunt]

I would respect your rank in front of him out of respect for him because he loves the marine corps and I wouldnt ever wanna disrespect him.

[SGT6124]

You have seen the light!

[SGT6124]

Like I said, you talk a good game, but I bet your a really good guy underneath all that "toughness".

[notamotogrunt]

Never said i wasnt a good guy I just hate marine corp bs and some select ncos who think theyre gods cause they got stripes. Ive laid an asswhiping to one before and I would do it again.

[SGT6124]

Never said i wasnt a good guy I just hate marine corp bs and some select ncos who think theyre gods cause they got stripes. Ive laid an asswhiping to one before and I would do it again.
Everyone hates the MC BS! Find me one Marine that doesn't and I will buy them a 6 pack. Um, you probably hate those NCO's because they have corrected you at one point in your short career and you hold it against them. You wouldn't be threatening to whip and NCO's ass infront of your First Sergeant, so I think we can just hide behind him and we will all be safe.

[notamotogrunt]

I have never not one time threatend an NCO. One got in my face once and said something to the effect you might not wanna do that again bitch. I didnt say a word I just cracked him right in the mouth. Man before Im a marine and I def aint no bitch and Im not gonna let someone address me as such.

[notamotogrunt]

Tell you right now that was a grunt cpl that I cracked. If a pog ever mustered up the balls to stick a finger in my face and call me a bitch bassically games over folks I def be a pfc after that one.

[notamotogrunt]

Naw I wouldnt do it I find some boot to go for me lol

[notamotogrunt]

Thats not how it works. Maybe in pog land but def not in grunts. Ive seen boot lances standing at parade rest for pfcs. Thats how it works.

[d3v1ld0g]

Thats not how it works. Maybe in pog land but def not in grunts. Ive seen boot lances standing at parade rest for pfcs. Thats how it works.


I think the protein shakes have gotten to your head dude....I may be a nearly 3 year lance corporal, but if I ever saw you disrespect an NCO like that, I would light your a** up. I really don't care how big and bad you may be, but I call bullsh*t on this whole thing. Also for somebody who complains about "POG's" in front of the computer all the time, you sure do have a lot of posts today. All this aside, dude you seriously need to be redirected about the MC. My time here has been both bad and good. Everywhere you go there is gonna be somebody telling you what to do. Get over it, its life DEAL WITH IT!! Also, ive seen bullsh*t happen to many of marines. Trust me its not just us junior marines, its everyone. Now you can take this how you want, but grow the hell up and be a man. Its time to do a radio check with that brain of yours and think about what you are doing and how your actions are affecting the MC. You may hate the MC, but once you become a civilian, do you really want to think that your military who defends your country is nothing but a bunch of snot nosed, immature, undisciplined retards? If Marines like you don't fix yourselves, our beloved corps is going to turn into a daycare with guns.
So do us all a favor and do your time and then get out.

S/F
LCPL Devildog

[SGT6124]

great post!

[ChaplainC]

If Marines ... don't fix yourselves, our beloved corps is going to turn into a daycare with guns.

S/F
LCPL Devildog

True words there. Not to mention a rather humorous visual... ;)

[notamotogrunt]

Listen here boot (thats you lcpl devildog). Im sitting in front of a cpu because I wa recently wounded in combat (that the thing that marines do to earn names such as devil dog btw). And the fact that you say you would light someone up for disrespecting an nco says only one thing to me and that is you have no gag reflex when it comes to dipping on your "senior" marines. Trust me Im not hurting your marine corps, I stay out of your beloved corps and deal with the real marines and real men everyday boot. And if you ever tried to yell at me I would laugh you out of the room boss. God forbid for your sake that I be with one of the three pump lances. Theyd put your boot ass at parade rest and dd you so fast you wouldnt know what happened.

[The Universal Curmudgeon_guest]

If Marines like you don't fix yourselves, our beloved corps is going to turn into a daycare with guns.
So do us all a favor and do your time and then get out.

S/F
LCPL DevildogA bit of perspective here. Joined in 1961, commissioned in 1963, left at mandatory retirement age in 1999.

'Nuf said.

Now the substance.

Absolutely right. If the Juniour NCOs don't uphold the traditions and character of the service, no one will. There isn't an officer in the world who can do it in the face of slack and apathetic NCOs. (After all, we only really exist to add a bit of "tone" to what would otherwise be a rather vulgar brawl.)

Admittedly, an officer who is determined to uphold the traditions and character of the service CAN encourage the "good" NCOs and discourage the "bad" - but without a core of "good" NCOs to start with, the task is daunting almost to the point of impossibility.

[ASIDE TO JUNIOUR OFFICERS - The trick is to get the NCOs to want to be something other than slack and apathetic - just as the trick with the nonNCOs is to get them to want to do the job to the best of their abilities. They will only do that when the expected (NOTE - NOT "demanded") standard is "Excellent" AND you live up to the expected standard AND they get prompt and appropriate recognition for their successes.]

[USSConstellation]

Listen here boot (thats you lcpl devildog). Im sitting in front of a cpu because I wa recently wounded in combat (that the thing that marines do to earn names such as devil dog btw). And the fact that you say you would light someone up for disrespecting an nco says only one thing to me and that is you have no gag reflex when it comes to dipping on your "senior" marines. Trust me Im not hurting your marine corps, I stay out of your beloved corps and deal with the real marines and real men everyday boot. And if you ever tried to yell at me I would laugh you out of the room boss. God forbid for your sake that I be with one of the three pump lances. Theyd put your boot ass at parade rest and dd you so fast you wouldnt know what happened.

Hey so since you are some tough guy, how bout letting me know your unit and name?

[notamotogrunt]

I love the way you pogs think. For the record Ive never blown off a staff NCO and only on a few occassions an NCO in uniform (out of uniform different story). I really dont understand how you two voicing your meek an pogmoto opinions about YOUR beloved corps here really has anything to do with the thread at hand. Im also not stupid there devil pups. If I put my unit on hear your gonna show up down on H street and start running your higher up pleasure device (your mouth) about how i disrespect SNCOs and NCOs and wont shut up until there is something done about it (ie paper work) and im not losing money over a pog internet tough guy.

[notamotogrunt]

Look boot when I pick up which aint all that far off I wont be messing with the Lcpls whove been through combat because Im not senior to them. I wouldnt expect them to be addressing me by rank cause that aint how it works in the grunts. Now boots on the contrary they address anyone and everyone of a senior rank by rank by senior lcpls dont call cpls cpl and some sgts its just how it is.

[USSConstellation]

Look boot when I pick up which aint all that far off I wont be messing with the Lcpls whove been through combat because Im not senior to them. I wouldnt expect them to be addressing me by rank cause that aint how it works in the grunts. Now boots on the contrary they address anyone and everyone of a senior rank by rank by senior lcpls dont call cpls cpl and some sgts its just how it is.

Are you an 0311?

[notamotogrunt]

0351. Which I actually picked a bad one there for a couple reasons. One of the highest cut score in the corps and I havent gotten to touch demo since Ive been to the fleet. I just do the same job as either an 11 or 31 depending on the day or mission

[USSConstellation]

0351. Which I actually picked a bad one there for a couple reasons. One of the highest cut score in the corps and I havent gotten to touch demo since Ive been to the fleet. I just do the same job as either an 11 or 31 depending on the day or mission


Why hasn't a Marine with such skill as you gotten promoted yet?

[notamotogrunt]

Never said I was extremely skilled. I love it when you all get butthurt and put words in peoples mouth. Anyone in the infantry will tell you unless you are a 41 or 52 picking up rank is tougher than hell and takes time. I also got my pros and cons dropped for a while when I cracked that cpl but the are coming back up this quarter.

[USSConstellation]

Never said I was extremely skilled. I love it when you all get butthurt and put words in peoples mouth. Anyone in the infantry will tell you unless you are a 41 or 52 picking up rank is tougher than hell and takes time. I also got my pros and cons dropped for a while when I cracked that cpl but the are coming back up this quarter.

I am not butthurt in the least bit kid. It's no ones fault but your own for getting your pros and cons knocked down. You are lucky you didn't get sent to the Brig for assualt or NJp'd. Maybe if you had a little more self control then it would be a whole different story
Picking up rank is hard as shit in my field as well, it's not only about the "grunts"

[notamotogrunt]

Never blamed anyone else. I knew the consequences of my actions and the guy had it coming which is why i didnt get njpd. He couldve pushed for it but he knew he was wrong and didnt hold a punch in the face against me. my command just had to give me some kindof repurcussion which was a page 11 and lower pros and cons

[d3v1ld0g]

Your on H street huh? Well im right down the road from you....Lets see if I get this right. Your an 0351 whos on Camp Lejeune, and works on H street. kinda narrows it down a bit. Well I really dont care who you are or who you think you are, but this is the point we are all making. Its guys like you who ruin it for the rest of us. This is EXACTLY why the Corps is the was it is today. You wanna know why the MC has so many stupid rules? Its because of marines like you who do stupid things and have no Corps Values in them. This dead horse can be beat all day, but at the end of the day when I take my boots off im still proud to say im a Devildog. Dont forget it!


S/F
LCPL Devildog

[notamotogrunt]

Dont tell me I ruin it for the rest of the marines. Just because Im not a lap dog like you who chokes on his higher ups members everyday (and you still cant pick up) doesnt mean I do stupid stuff. Matter of fact I have only gotten introuble once and that was for beating on that retard. Im proud to be a marine too and that I have had the opportunity to fight like a "devil dog" so dont think your boot a## is something special or better than me.

[d3v1ld0g]

Dont tell me I ruin it for the rest of the marines. Just because Im not a lap dog like you who chokes on his higher ups members everyday (and you still cant pick up) doesnt mean I do stupid stuff. Matter of fact I have only gotten introuble once and that was for beating on that retard. Im proud to be a marine too and that I have had the opportunity to fight like a "devil dog" so dont think your boot a## is something special or better than me.

No dude, your right im not special. As for you, I can tell that your a very special marine. Pat yourself on the back for being SPECIAL!

[Cpl.Morin/5831MCASMiramar]

My husband who is also an active duty Marine made a great point the other day. His troops were arguing over this ridiculous article, and he asked them a question. If you do not know a Marines name, and you would like to get his attention, you would say hey Devil Dog. You wouldn't say hey you, no one would freaking answer you. If you were in a PX and a Marine said hey Devil Dog, you would turn around for one of two reasons...one, you were actually doing something wrong so the term to you would indicate trouble(which is usually the case with Marines who get Devil Dogged and get their feelings hurt) or two, your a damn Marine and know that the term is equivalent to Leatherneck, Marine, Shock Troop, all the motivated monikers that we have. The brand new Marines need to get the hell over their sensitive politacally correct feelings and grow some balls. We are Marines, and there is no freaking room for sensitivity in our damn Corps. Sensitivity is how you get your ass killed. The new troops coming out of bootcamp need some real Marine Corps training, or maybe just change services. And I can definitly comment on this seeing how my little brother is one of those "babied Marines". He got told the same damn thing.

[USSConstellation]

Dont tell me I ruin it for the rest of the marines. Just because Im not a lap dog like you who chokes on his higher ups members everyday (and you still cant pick up) doesnt mean I do stupid stuff. Matter of fact I have only gotten introuble once and that was for beating on that retard. Im proud to be a marine too and that I have had the opportunity to fight like a "devil dog" so dont think your boot a## is something special or better than me.

Wow you continue to make me sick enough that I want to just puke

[notamotogrunt]

Getting devil dogged dont hurt my feelings it is just annoying. Also please please dont tell me what would get you killed morin you have NO IDEA. Your work in the brig right so you def havent been there and done it and its marines like you saying hey devil dog to me that makes me wanna puke because they havent done anything to rate to correct me or other people who have actually done something.
As for making you sick you seem to keep forgetting that I DONT CARE about how i make you feel and if that post where I really didnt say anything bad makes you feel sick then you might want to consider a change in carreer cuz you get worked up way way to easy.

[USSConstellation]

Getting devil dogged dont hurt my feelings it is just annoying. Also please please dont tell me what would get you killed morin you have NO IDEA. Your work in the brig right so you def havent been there and done it and its marines like you saying hey devil dog to me that makes me wanna puke because they havent done anything to rate to correct me or other people who have actually done something.
As for making you sick you seem to keep forgetting that I DONT CARE about how i make you feel and if that post where I really didnt say anything bad makes you feel sick then you might want to consider a change in carreer cuz you get worked up way way to easy.

hey POS Marine.........have many times have you been deployed?

[notamotogrunt]

I have 2 combat deployments and bout to go on a third.

[USSConstellation]

I have 2 combat deployments and bout to go on a third.

and where were these so called places and during what times? You are still a Lcpl? Wow I bet there is an under lying reason for that, gee I wonder what that could be

[d3v1ld0g]

Wait...you just told us your on the computer because you are recovering from being shot and now your saying your going on a third deployment....which one is it?