Why Do These MOS's Even Exist?

[dgeezy]

0100 - The Enitre OccFld. Civilians can do all of that.
3000 - Civilians
3100 - Traffic Managment?? WTF???
3381 - Come on now, cooks? The hot chow marines make is nasty, we have KBR and Sodexho working the chowhalls, this MOS definitley shouldnt exist. MRE's are sufficient for the field.
3400 - Financial Managment - Once again, not a job for marines, for civilians.
and of course THE PX Marines... "what do you do in the marine corps??" " I WORK AT WAL MART.

My Theroy is half of these MOS exists soley because its cheaper to pay a pfc 1000 bucks a month instead of a civilian 3000 a month to do it.

[UnCommon Sense]

Are you serious? Your theory is seriously flawed and very ignorant. GS-5/6 who do these jobs (yes, there are many...and more to come) are actually paid less than what LCpl/Cpl or even Sgts are paid. I knew a sergeant who got out and took a GS-7 job - along with a $13,000/year pay cut.

How long do you think a Marine stays a PFC?

How much "loyalty" or "dedication" do you think civilians have towards taking care of Marines - not "their own"? For the most part, they don't exactly understand what Marines go through or how their jobs really impact the Marines they provide services for.

Sure, civilians can do these things, but is it better that way? When you get some experience in your brain, you'll know the answer. Four letters can prove you wrong right now: NMCI.

Why not get rid of infantry then too? Blackwater and other mercenaries can do what they do, right? Motor-T can go away too; there are plenty of civilian truck drivers and mechanics who can do those jobs. How about pilots? There are plenty of aerobatic flight schools for civilians - some of those pilots are probably better than military pilots. Hell, with your line of thinking, why not just deactivate the whole Marine Corps and let the other branches do it. They have ground, sea and air too...Army, Navy and Air Force can do it all.

My theory is that you should read the Marine Corps Manual.

[ninebreaker]

there are MOS's out there that really need to go away
there's no agruing that
but at the same time though
when you do the math
Marines are always the better option
don't have to pay them overtime
easy to reason ,etc
having civilians in place brings in a whole other animal you really don't want to deal with
yeah the Corps is trying to utilize civilians more
like the Army does
but in the case of the Marine Corps it's more to relief units of the duties of that yes
a civilian contractor can do
like try to imagine a base forward deployed with no contracting at all
it would be like CAX year around
not MOJAVE VIPER , as in CAX
no a plesant though

[LeaderOfMarines]

Four letters can prove you wrong right now: NMCI.

Well, I have no choice but to fully agree with you on this. I have had to get 3 new Id's within the last year because of the computers and also where I work, you have to swipe your ID through a gate for security reasons...but come on. We are wasting so much money on NMCI and everything else.

[LethaNeck87]

[QUOTE=dgeezy;132213]0100 - The Enitre OccFld. Civilians can do all of that.

LEADEROFMARINES, I MEAN NO DISRESPECT BUT WHAT WERE YOU THINKING WHEN YOU WROTE THIS. I'M A 0151 AND LET ME TELL YOU A LITTLE SOMETHING ABOUT MY MOS. NOT EVERYONE CAN DO IT AND NOT EVERYONE WILL ACTUALLY CARE ABOUT THEIR MARINES. I DO ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING IN MY POWER TO HELP OUT MARINES WITH ANY ADMIN PROBLEMS THEY MIGHT HAVE. LIKE SOMEONE ELSE SAID BEFORE WHAT IS A CIVILIAN GOING TO CARE ABOUT YOUR BAH, YOUR PROMOTION, YOUR EVERYTHING. YOU DON'T KNOW KNOW WHAT I DO AS A 0151 AND I DONT CARE TO KNOW WHAT YOU DO. BUT YOU HAVE TO LEARN SOME RESPECT FOR EACH AND EVERY MOS. I MIGHT NOT HAVE MANY YEARS IN THE MARINE CORPS OR HAVE AS MUCH "WISDOM" AS YOU DO. BUT ONE THING IS FOR SURE I RESPECT MARINES AROUND ME, ONE CAN'T WORK WITH OUT THE OTHER. AND WE LOOK OUT FOR EACH OTHER YOU CAN'T LET A STARNGER COME IN AND HANDEL THINGS THAT RELATE TO YOUR MARINE CORPS CAREER... YOU HAVE NO IDEA HOW PROFESSIONAL I AM TRYING TO BE... UNLIKE SOME PEOPLE I'LL GIVE YOU SOME RESPECT... EVEN THOUGH AFTER THE COMMENTS YOU JUST PUT UP YOU REALLY DON'T DESERVE IT...

[ninebreaker]

Well, I have no choice but to fully agree with you on this. I have had to get 3 new Id's within the last year because of the computers and also where I work, you have to swipe your ID through a gate for security reasons...but come on. We are wasting so much money on NMCI and everything else.

yeah I have to agree on the count
that NMCI is a complete waste of time
the loops you have to jump to get anything done with them is beyond retarded

[Gunny08]

LETHANECK87-
I believe you should reconsider your attack on LeaderofMarines.

[USMC_8156]

NMCI is being eliminated approx. 2011. It will be handed back over to the comm Marines. FYI.

As to the other ones, I'd rather have Marines taking care of all of that, personally. Have you ever had to get a civilian to fix something? Jeez...I can just imagine them outsourcing Admin to India.

[LeaderOfMarines]

[QUOTE=dgeezy;132213]0100 - The Enitre OccFld. Civilians can do all of that.

LEADEROFMARINES, I MEAN NO DISRESPECT BUT WHAT WERE YOU THINKING WHEN YOU WROTE THIS. I'M A 0151 AND LET ME TELL YOU A LITTLE SOMETHING ABOUT MY MOS. NOT EVERYONE CAN DO IT AND NOT EVERYONE WILL ACTUALLY CARE ABOUT THEIR MARINES. I DO ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING IN MY POWER TO HELP OUT MARINES WITH ANY ADMIN PROBLEMS THEY MIGHT HAVE. LIKE SOMEONE ELSE SAID BEFORE WHAT IS A CIVILIAN GOING TO CARE ABOUT YOUR BAH, YOUR PROMOTION, YOUR EVERYTHING. YOU DON'T KNOW KNOW WHAT I DO AS A 0151 AND I DONT CARE TO KNOW WHAT YOU DO. BUT YOU HAVE TO LEARN SOME RESPECT FOR EACH AND EVERY MOS. I MIGHT NOT HAVE MANY YEARS IN THE MARINE CORPS OR HAVE AS MUCH "WISDOM" AS YOU DO. BUT ONE THING IS FOR SURE I RESPECT MARINES AROUND ME, ONE CAN'T WORK WITH OUT THE OTHER. AND WE LOOK OUT FOR EACH OTHER YOU CAN'T LET A STARNGER COME IN AND HANDEL THINGS THAT RELATE TO YOUR MARINE CORPS CAREER... YOU HAVE NO IDEA HOW PROFESSIONAL I AM TRYING TO BE... UNLIKE SOME PEOPLE I'LL GIVE YOU SOME RESPECT... EVEN THOUGH AFTER THE COMMENTS YOU JUST PUT UP YOU REALLY DON'T DESERVE IT...

Hey buddy.....I didn't write that post. You are attacking the wrong person. DGEEZY wrote it and you even quoted him.

[dgeezy]

Ok first off, What is a civilian going to care??? Umm maybe losing their job. If it's ran like a business it will work just fine. Civilians CARE alot more than some boot PFC or Lance coolie just trying to skate through another day to make it back to the barracks to play xbox. Civilians can be FIRED, Marines cant, if they fuck up, all they have to do is say Lcpl dont know, and they get chewed out and the problem gets fixed. A civilian fucks up, theyre kaput, FIRED BAM! Out the door. So Id probably say civilians care more about their jobs than marines do.

Ok UnCommon Sense, you need to use a little. The Infantry is what the marine corps is all about, thats where the actual dedication and pride rest's. not in ADMIN or FOOD SERVICE. Motor T and Aircraft relate DIRECTLY to combat, so those MOS's are necessary.

What Im saying we should take all these POG ass MOS's and let civilians do them, or hand them over to the navy. Let the marine corps truly be THE ELITE. Instead of THE ELITE with a bunch of nasty POG's running around.

[USMC_8156]

Ok first off, What is a civilian going to care??? Umm maybe losing their job. If it's ran like a business it will work just fine. Civilians CARE alot more than some boot PFC or Lance coolie just trying to skate through another day to make it back to the barracks to play xbox. Civilians can be FIRED, Marines cant, if they fuck up, all they have to do is say Lcpl dont know, and they get chewed out and the problem gets fixed. A civilian fucks up, theyre kaput, FIRED BAM! Out the door. So Id probably say civilians care more about their jobs than marines do.

I think you are seriously overestimating a couple of things. The level of civilian who would be hired to do this kind of job would be making around 14$ an hour, maybe less. Entry level / throw away jobs like this, and you think they will value this like they suddenly got a spot at Google?

Also, have you considered the security risk and irritation level of having a million civilians working on base? I get irritated enough with all of the dependants running around (don't start, you), the last thing I want to deal with is running into the lunch crowd while I'm trying to make a dash in the PX.

I just think that you are overestimating how much a civilian cares about their 10 dollar an hour job.



Ok UnCommon Sense, you need to use a little. The Infantry is what the marine corps is all about, thats where the actual dedication and pride rest's. not in ADMIN or FOOD SERVICE. Motor T and Aircraft relate DIRECTLY to combat, so those MOS's are necessary.

Yeah, but at what point do you stop. Where does it stop "directly" relating, and end up "indirectly" relating. I think you are aiming at purely desk/paperwork oriented jobs. Still...I'd rather have a Marine taking care of it. I don't see the level of laziness that you do. I'll tell you one thing, those admin POG's don't get naptime after formation, bud.


What Im saying we should take all these POG ass MOS's and let civilians do them, or hand them over to the navy. Let the marine corps truly be THE ELITE. Instead of THE ELITE with a bunch of nasty POG's running around.

Same old argument...same lack of substance.

[ninebreaker]

Ok first off, What is a civilian going to care??? Umm maybe losing their job. If it's ran like a business it will work just fine. Civilians CARE alot more than some boot PFC or Lance coolie just trying to skate through another day to make it back to the barracks to play xbox. Civilians can be FIRED, Marines cant, if they fuck up, all they have to do is say Lcpl dont know, and they get chewed out and the problem gets fixed. A civilian fucks up, theyre kaput, FIRED BAM! Out the door. So Id probably say civilians care more about their jobs than marines do.

yeah civilians can lose their job and yeah marines cant be fired so what is the difference
oh i dont know, hmm
lets see
i just a Marine in from stateside a few weeks ago ,tells me that CIF told him he did not rate a piece of gear,
his sncos went back over and they were told no as well
i contact my supply ,and the only thing they ask was does he rate it,
well according to the CIF website, he does
good to go
he can put one up tomorrow
nuff said '

Ok UnCommon Sense, you need to use a little. The Infantry is what the marine corps is all about, thats where the actual dedication and pride rest's. not in ADMIN or FOOD SERVICE. Motor T and Aircraft relate DIRECTLY to combat, so those MOS's are necessary.

yeah that's why a squadron recieved has the commandants' trophy this year
and that why' you can make any marine a rifleman
but can't make a rifleman anything else
cause whereas we can learn a grunt's job in a matter of weeks
however a grunt trying to learn the POGs MOS that actually require brain power
well simply aint happen
cause the prerequisite is brain power ,if grunts had any then they would not be asking where are other MOS out there


What Im saying we should take all these POG ass MOS's and let civilians do them, or hand them over to the navy. Let the marine corps truly be THE ELITE. Instead of THE ELITE with a bunch of nasty POG's running around.

yeah
lets see
when your ass needs resupply, or to get some where Motor T
pay problem etc, S-1
on and off ship, around country, medicvac, the wing
standing guard while you sleep, PMO
contrary to popular, you are not going to get a civilian to all that underfire
only reason civilians are ever being considered right now
is that we need relief, we are being wore out
maIntain world wide commitents
aint easy
but what would you know about that ,

[JLMartin]

DGEEZY,
Do you know that most of the civilian positions on base, after the first year, they can't be fired? The type of people that they would need to fill these positions, they would have to do some sort of background check because I don't want LCpl Nasties Wife dealing with my pay issues. The people they hire would have to be of some caliber. The first year, sure, they walk on egg shells but once that years up, it's all gone to shit. Have you been to IPAC lately? There are civilians running it, just at the seperations section alone, the civilian is the boss. From what I've heard and seen, it's not working out so well!
Just look at the CIF and how well that's worked out for everyone.....spending 3 hours in line to turn in your gear just to be turned away because of some stupid reason or another. I think they should have left supply up to your BN Supply to issue you the gear like it used to be. I think the gear you get issued is a better kept up with now, however, who really has time to spend ALL day at the CIF.
I won't start on NMCI, but thank god we aren't renewing that contract!

[SSgtAllen3381]

Im an 0331 since you asked. Second, I wasnt talking about hot chow as in the chowhalls (even though they suck too) I was talking about the crap they feed us in the field that comes out of the vats or whatever they are, its garbage!!! And you know it. Food Service is a waste of money and time. I would rather eat MRE's all freaking day than half of the crap served by cooks.

On another note, Sodexho needs to go too, youre right, their chow is garbage. Sodexho provides most of america's prisions with food services too, so you can telll that the contract defininetly went to the lowest bidder. I personally think they should get rid of chowhalls all together. Its bull that if a marine is single, he has to pay for crap chow that he probably wont even eat half of the time anyways.

Like I said, let someone that can actually help you know. I'm not sure where you are, so I can't give you the exact person you need to talk to; at the Mess Hall.

No, I don't know the chow you are eating is garbage. I don't know what Mess Hall you get your food from. Again, don't blame Marine Cooks for something they can't control. You saying derogatory things about a whole MOS is like me saying the whole 0311 field is jacked up...that is just wrong and not true.

[USMC_8156]

I personally think they should get rid of chowhalls all together. Its bull that if a marine is single, he has to pay for crap chow that he probably wont even eat half of the time anyways.

I don't think you've really thought this through. If there were no chow halls, and everyone made Comrats, what would happen to every single pfc and lance coolie that blows their pay check in the first week? I remember making $600 every two weeks, it's nothing. I would have starved if I didn't have that free chow hall to fall back on.

Next, you would have to allow Marines to cook in the bricks. That isn't going to happen, because not only do we not have the time, money, or facilities, some idiot would burn the place to the ground.

Then you would have to justify how these Marines are getting a balanced meal. You know what most PFC's fresh out of SOI or MOS School who hit the fleet are going to do? Eat cheeseburgers and pizza all day every day, if they have the chance. Which makes any attempt at physical conditioning a waste of time.

And come on man, let's be real here. I've eaten at a chow hall on all but...Japan, basically. Is it gourmet cordon bleu? No. But it's decent, well balanced food that is all you can eat. Hell, you can even get chicken nuggets at some places.

As for eating MRE's all day every day in the field, you can have it. I'll take the vat of mystery after about a week of MRE's.

[RETSGTMAJ]

[
How much "loyalty" or "dedication" do you think civilians have towards taking care of Marines - not "their own"? For the most part, they don't exactly understand what Marines go through or how their jobs really impact the Marines they provide services for.

I guess that really depends on the "civilian" being hired. I spent 30 years in the Marine Corps, first as an 03, then in the 01 field, onto 1stSgt and SgtMaj. So to be honest I do not consider myself a civilian, but a retired Marine. I took one of the entry level GS positions that was converted from the USMC and go out of my way to assist any Marine who needs it. I had my time at the "top" and now enjoy being one of the gang again. Yes there are many civilians working in this system who do not care other then getting their pay check, but I am not one of them. I will always be a Marine and continue to serve and assist Marines until the day they bury me. OOH RAH!!

[SSgtB1990]

The point of having these Marines in these MOSs is that they are deployable. It costs significantly more to send a civilian than a Marine to Iraq, even if they never leave base. Believe it or not, those Marines are working for YOU, as a Marine. My first enlistment I was TMO, and let me tell you during the build-up of Desert Shield/Storm, we worked crazy hours. You can't make a civilian do that. Period. And as someone else said, it is hard as hell to fire a civilian so they can actually become more complacent than any Marine I've ever come across.

I wish everyone would just realize that all jobs are needed for the good for the Corps. Period. Some of you fight the war, others of you support that fight in other ways. It's just that simple.

[dgeezy]

I don't think you've really thought this through. If there were no chow halls, and everyone made Comrats, what would happen to every single pfc and lance coolie that blows their pay check in the first week? I remember making $600 every two weeks, it's nothing. I would have starved if I didn't have that free chow hall to fall back on.

Next, you would have to allow Marines to cook in the bricks. That isn't going to happen, because not only do we not have the time, money, or facilities, some idiot would burn the place to the ground.

Then you would have to justify how these Marines are getting a balanced meal. You know what most PFC's fresh out of SOI or MOS School who hit the fleet are going to do? Eat cheeseburgers and pizza all day every day, if they have the chance. Which makes any attempt at physical conditioning a waste of time.

And come on man, let's be real here. I've eaten at a chow hall on all but...Japan, basically. Is it gourmet cordon bleu? No. But it's decent, well balanced food that is all you can eat. Hell, you can even get chicken nuggets at some places.

As for eating MRE's all day every day in the field, you can have it. I'll take the vat of mystery after about a week of MRE's.

Ok, the chow is NOT FREE. Every Marine Pays for it, you just never see the money they take out.
2nd. If a marine is stupid enough to blow his paycheck instead of providing himself with food, he deserves to starve. Its called being responsible. Last time I checked every marine is 18 years old or older (except for a few 17 year olds. Theyre adults, let them grow up.
3rd. You dont have to let the marines do shit in the barracks. they can buy their meals. If they want to buy cheeseburgers and pizza and get fat, fine. discharge them for being fat. The corps doesnt need them. Living in the Barracks is bs anyways, but thats another topic.
4th. Balanced meals at the chow hall?? Get real, they might as well be feeding marines pizza and burgers every day with the fat and carb content of the crap on the main line.

[USMC_8156]

Ok, the chow is NOT FREE. Every Marine Pays for it, you just never see the money they take out.
2nd. If a marine is stupid enough to blow his paycheck instead of providing himself with food, he deserves to starve. Its called being responsible. Last time I checked every marine is 18 years old or older (except for a few 17 year olds. Theyre adults, let them grow up.
3rd. You dont have to let the marines do shit in the barracks. they can buy their meals. If they want to buy cheeseburgers and pizza and get fat, fine. discharge them for being fat. The corps doesnt need them. Living in the Barracks is bs anyways, but thats another topic.
4th. Balanced meals at the chow hall?? Get real, they might as well be feeding marines pizza and burgers every day with the fat and carb content of the crap on the main line.

By "they can buy their meals" I assume you mean they can eat out every day. There is no healthy way to eat out 3-5 times a day. It isn't possible. If you can't cook, then brownbagging it from the barracks would mean sandwiches all day every day.

Every chow hall I've ever been at (which is a few) has a fatboy line, and a healthy line. The healthy line pretty much always has some kind of pasta or casserole, a starch, two kinds of veggies, and a second main course. It's similar to what your mom made you. It is a well balanced meal. I suppose if you are on some crock Atkins diet or something, you won't get your carbless meal, but that's just too damn bad.

Nobody deserves to starve...that's just childish. These days an 18 year old out of high school and boot camp acts more like the 15 year olds of days past.

[Sgt D]

0100 - The Enitre OccFld. Civilians can do all of that.
3000 - Civilians
3100 - Traffic Managment?? WTF???
3381 - Come on now, cooks? The hot chow marines make is nasty, we have KBR and Sodexho working the chowhalls, this MOS definitley shouldnt exist. MRE's are sufficient for the field.
3400 - Financial Managment - Once again, not a job for marines, for civilians.
and of course THE PX Marines... "what do you do in the marine corps??" " I WORK AT WAL MART.

My Theroy is half of these MOS exists soley because its cheaper to pay a pfc 1000 bucks a month instead of a civilian 3000 a month to do it.


Young man, I am a 4133(MWR Speicalist) and damn proud of it. I don't work in WalMart, and quite frankly I take huge offense to your comment. But, since you asked the question, I will explain why my MOS exists:

Point 1, Deployments. The MCX Civillians that we have working with us in Iraq are making, basically, double pay. I have to tell you, that's not cheap. Remember, our profits go back to programs and Facilities for the Marines and Sailors. So, while a lot of Customers gripe and groan about the cost of the Merchandise in the Exchange, those same Marines are enjoying the things that their money is buying. If there was no MCCS then there would be no Gym for our muscleheads to get big in (at least not as nice as the ones Iv'e been in). There would be no Single Marine Program to get the Marines out of the Barracks. There are so many Programs out there for Marines and Sailors on our Bases that would not exist if MCCS wasn't around. Where else can you watch a movie for $2?? Sometimes even free?? No where, I say.

Point 2, influence. You don't realize what an impact it has to have a Marine in the Store working with the Civillians. It would take too long to explain it, so your'e going to have to believe me on this one.

I read a post from an Admin Marine further up the line that was talking about how hard he works to get your Admin issues dealt with... I assure you, every Marine that Iv'e met in this MOS is the same way. Iv'e had Marines ask me for the craziest things, and love the look that I get when I can make it happen for them. Especially when I was in Iraq. Marines would come into the Store all nasty, dirty, tired and see what we had to offer. It was like the weight was lifted off their shoulders... And don't even get me started on WES Teams. Do you think the Civillians are going to go to the FOBs and bring you a piece of home? I don't.

Go ahead and criticize those MOSs, but I for one am glad that they exist. I wouldn't want a Civillian handling my Admin problems, or my pay. I'd rather have a Marine that's been in as long as me or longer looking over the shoulder of a LCpl and making sure that it gets done right the first time.

[RETSGTMAJ]

[QUOTE=Sgt D;
If there was no MCCS then there would be no Gym for our muscleheads to get big in (at least not as nice as the ones Iv'e been in). There would be no Single Marine Program to get the Marines out of the Barracks. There are so many Programs out there for Marines and Sailors on our Bases that would not exist if MCCS wasn't around. Where else can you watch a movie for $2?? Sometimes even free?? No where, I say.

Sgt D, you are a wise leader. Your post was right on the money except for one thing. We had gyms, bowling centers, movies, lonf before MCCS was ever thought of. When we had "Special Services", it was run by Marines for Marines, and everything was free. All you had to do was show your ID card and u bowled free, went to the movies free, used the gym and anything else the base had for free. I for one would love to see only Marines in our PX system, but that will never happen again. I am not now, or have ever been a fan of MCCS.

[magoo]

dgeezy
you don't seem to grasp the concept that you're complaining about.

as a comm marine, nothing pissed me off more than NMCI basically taking my job away. all i can do now, is feel the frustration, and more, than the typical marine feels when all the work is being "put off" by those civilians that are getting paid large bucks for something i can and did do while on the horn, or speaking face to face.

anytime civilians are introduced to the system, there are incredible levels of complexity added all over. the chain of command becomes diluted, the esprit de corps is non existent, it's just not a good situation at all.

in response to your post "let the ELITE do what they do best"

[Lone_NCO]

Dgeezy I'm actually curious why do you think those MOS's should be replaced by civilians? I hope you dont say because you think they could do it better, or it'd be more cost efficient, or because they complain less...you get the idea, but I really do wanna know.

Some information you didnt seem to know before has come to light, maybe you changed your mind....

[SSgtAllen3381]

Maybe he's bucking for one of those weedeater guy positions?

[SSgtB1990]

[QUOTE=Sgt D;
Sgt D, you are a wise leader. Your post was right on the money except for one thing. We had gyms, bowling centers, movies, lonf before MCCS was ever thought of. When we had "Special Services", it was run by Marines for Marines, and everything was free. All you had to do was show your ID card and u bowled free, went to the movies free, used the gym and anything else the base had for free. I for one would love to see only Marines in our PX system, but that will never happen again. I am not now, or have ever been a fan of MCCS.


I agree with you, SgtMaj. I remember when the USO used to be the place to be. They had great events and facilities for Marines to utilize but then MCCS came and took over (at a price of course) and the USO is all but non-existant. It's sad. I'm not a fan of MCCS either.

[ninebreaker]

[QUOTE=RETSGTMAJ;135012]


I agree with you, SgtMaj. I remember when the USO used to be the place to be. They had great events and facilities for Marines to utilize but then MCCS came and took over (at a price of course) and the USO is all but non-existant. It's sad. I'm not a fan of MCCS either.


true about MCCS

USO is still the place when you wanna look for when you are traveling through the major airports

[CSBurns]

Dont' knock MCCS too hard, they were created because MWR was taking some of our money from the bases. Remember MWR was all four services, MCCS is just the Corps and all the money stays with the base and goes back to the activities.

I was on Lejeune in Jan/Feb of 2007 and compared to the last time I was there in 2003(MCCS just started I think) and then from 1994 to 1996(MWR). It was a HUGE improvement, eberyone complains about something when they have no previous context to compare it to.


So use this: Here you have $100, MWR will take $80 and spread it to the rest of the services (but not the Marines or even your base) so you get $20.

With MCCS you have $100 and you keep it all at that base. Plus if you don' tell MCCS what you want, they have no idea what you want........crazy I know but it's true.

[SSgtB1990]

, eberyone complains about something when they have no previous context to compare it to. Plus if you don' tell MCCS what you want, they have no idea what you want........crazy I know but it's true.

I understand what you're saying. But don't assume I'm "complaining" because I don't have a context to compare it to. So imagine this...I was in Oki from 90-93. There was a USO on every base. They had tours, game nights, movie nights, all kinds of events for us, really cheap food and they stayed open late so we could hang out on a Friday night without having to go out and get drunk. They also had celebrities that would come and give concerts on Futenma on the airfield. We had first rate comedians, etc. Oh, and did I mention they were FREE!!

Fast forward to more recently and there's not a USO to be found. There was one on Camp Hansen for a while but that too has closed. Now they have MCCS activities that sponsor the SMP, etc. but everything is priced (and overpriced too, I might add). If there's a concert, we're paying $50 or better. So although our opinion on MCCS isn't the same, don't assume that I don't have a context to compare it to. I realize that MCCS puts money back into the system, blah, blah, blah, but we ultimately pay for that.

[CSBurns]

The USO is also a donation driven organization that has no connection to MWR or AAFES or MCCS. If donations go down because prices get higher on things, then they have to cut some things back. I remember that the USO was still on Schwab in 97 when I left Okinawa, great place loved using it. I also remember being on New River in 2003 and watching a Sugar Ray Concert for free that was put together by MCCS. Not everything is going to be free, we are going to have to pay for it one way or another.

And my complaining comment wasn't targeted at anyone specifically, there Marines out there that have never known anything other than MCCS.

I do belive the USO has tried to do other things for deployed troops instead of fixed bases say in Okinawa etc. I will take that substitution anyday, they need it more than we do.

[Sgt D]

MCCS exists, as I understand things, because Congress decided to stop funding all of those 'free' activities that you are so fondly recalling. The MCCS Facilities are now Non-Appropirated Fund (ie. not paid for by the Government) Facilities. As I said before, those funds have to come from SOMEWHERE, and the best plan anyone could come up with (and I challenge anyone to think of something feasibly better) was MCCS. I can tell you, MCCS does everything they can to keep costs as low and as reasonable as possible across the board.

For example, people always complain about gas prices on Base. I'm not sure about other Bases, but I know that the gas pumps on Lejeune have a little diagram (pie chart) that shows you where the money made at the pumps goes. Indeed, the profits made are so low that it's almost not even worth the trouble of having the gas stations on Base. They will remain, though, because it's a service to the Marines, Sailors, Soldiers, Airmen, and Coasties.

If anyone has a question about MCCS, please feel free to post it here. Iv'e been working with them for over 2 years now and I can answer just about any question, and know exactly whom to ask for those that I don't know right off.

[RETSGTMAJ]

Yes and don't forget the outragious salaries MCCS bosses are paying themselves, and the bonus' they give themselves each year because of the hard work of their employees. I once worked for MCCS and can tell you many supervisors could not even do the job of their people. MCCS is really the poster boy of the "Good Ole Boy" network.

[ssgt8411]

Marines will stay past 1600 to get the job done, a civilian will not. Marines can be held accountable for poor performance (Pg 11, Pro's/Con's, FitReps), a civilian can not. We have personal standards as to when Marines are to be at work, or the courtesy they display to other Marines, Civilians do not...That is why we have those MOS'...Any other questions...

[wzgriffith]

Marines will stay past 1600 to get the job done, a civilian will not. Marines can be held accountable for poor performance (Pg 11, Pro's/Con's, FitReps), a civilian can not. We have personal standards as to when Marines are to be at work, or the courtesy they display to other Marines, Civilians do not...That is why we have those MOS'...Any other questions...

A-Men! A friend of mine is at a shop where they're trying to fire the civ they hired, but they can't because they didn't keep enough paperwork on the guy. There are, however, some really hard working GS's out there. Our ISMO guy is here until 22-2300 every night working on servers etc.

[Cpl Hack]

Sorry if I am stepping on any toes, but it seems to me people who call to kill these MOS's have no clue what they really do. I am a 3432, financial management, I am in Iraq doing my job. This doesn't mean I just standing at the window out here in Rawah, that portion could be replaced by an ATM. We do go out to the TCP's BP's, and smaller spots, with the PX guys. You may see the PX as WalMart employees but they work at their store and then hop on a resupply with me to come out and provide you with cash, dip, and fat-kid food, in the middle of the night. Furthermore, I am responsible for making payments to Iraqi's reconstruction projects with CAG, and condolence payments with the judge. In the states we could easily be civilianized and the issue of who cares more is rather weak, some Marines care some don't, same goes for the civilians I have worked with. It is deployments that force my job to be filled by Marines. I don't think anyone gets a warm and fuzzy entrusting the amount of cash I carry to a contractor. Beyond all this I am the duty expert in your pay and allowances, this means I spend a great deal of time explaining to Marines (of all ranks) their pay and allowances, leave and personal issues relating to finance (which I will be glad to do here if you have questions). You would be surprised how many of those Q&A sessions are a result of bad info from their small unit leaders, who would be much more effective if they called on the duty experts for a class. Until I deployed I too thought that my job could easily be replaced by GS employees, much to the USMC's benefit, but now I know there is much more to my MOS. I think this may go across the board but I will not speak for PX, mail, admin, and so on. I encourage anyone who believes these jobs to be pointless and filled with lazy POG's, to go and ask "exactly what it is they do here" and I assure you I am the only one who will only tell you "I have people skills" and leave it at that. In summation, you need to look at each MOS forward and RBE before you call for it to be civillianized.
R/S
Cpl Hack

[usmcforlife]

0100 - The Enitre OccFld. Civilians can do all of that.
3000 - Civilians
3100 - Traffic Managment?? WTF???
3381 - Come on now, cooks? The hot chow marines make is nasty, we have KBR and Sodexho working the chowhalls, this MOS definitley shouldnt exist. MRE's are sufficient for the field.
3400 - Financial Managment - Once again, not a job for marines, for civilians.
and of course THE PX Marines... "what do you do in the marine corps??" " I WORK AT WAL MART.

My Theroy is half of these MOS exists soley because its cheaper to pay a pfc 1000 bucks a month instead of a civilian 3000 a month to do it.

Re: Why Do These MOS's Even Exist?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
why do you even exist?. why would you even post this, are you even in the military toolbag. If you are thats , well lets just say you aren't because nobody in the armed forces could be as ignorant as you. you obviously live in your mommys house and have tooo much time on your hands. your one of those little kids that doesn't agree with the war and want to be a total liberal. Do your research whoever typed this, i dont even know how i came across this bullshit, but its garbage. Every MOS is deployed if your in more than one enlistment and yes we go "out the wire" to patrol and yes sometimes have to man a gunner. admin, cooks, intel, its all about infantry and we ALL play a role in supporting infantry. why would you want a loser like yourself doing admin for example in a combat zone when your a pussy that couldn't ever be trained or disciplined. so back to posting more garbage shitbird

[OlSkoolRaven]

Be carefull wha you ask for. We (the Air Force) went down this path and now we are short handed.

[Combat correspondent]

Raven's right about this ... some pencil-pushing General Officers look to Toyota nd say, wow, those Japanese guys really did a fantastic job of cutting waste, reducing employment numbers, and still manufature high-quality automobiles. They never take into account that Toyota employees don't depend on one another for survival, don't feed, house and clothes their buddies, don't take care of their own medical care or spiritual need, don't go into harm's way (except on the Tokyo subways --- lol), etc., etc. You just can't lean out a way of life to save $. Every MOS is needed in one way or another.

[bravohotel43]

I can't speak on the other MOS's, but I've heard people ask about mine (stateside, at least), and the response I've heard given can apply to all MOS's.

I'm a Marine, first and foremost. Everything I do is based on that one principle. Remembering that, I'll fight to make sure that what I do at all times is helping out my fellow Marines first, rather than myself. With the obvious exception of retired and former Marines, I don't see that in my civilian counterparts. They care about getting their name out there, shmoozing it up with reporters, and possibly landing that cushy gig at a major news outlet. Meanwhile, I diligently and happily write my 20th story about a lance cooley getting a circom, because what that Marine did deserves to be recognized by his peers Marine Corps-wide and his friends and family at home.