Anyone getting booted for PT failures close to retirement?

[FGO]

Just curious if anyone out there knows of any officer or SNCO with 15-20 years of service who has gotten booted out of the AF for repeated failures on the PT test. I understand there have been a few--but these were people who flat out decided they didn't want to do PT and didn't even try. I know of someone who's been recommended for separation (an officer), but they're still awaiting the SECAF's decision (and no, they were not one of those people who said "screw it--I don't want to do PT").

With all the talk coming from above about cracking down on the PT program and test, I'm wondering just how serious they are...

[technomage1]

I haven't seen anyone booted out, but I did see someone (2 someones, actually) get their career progression halted because of PT. Both were butterballs, and both were allowed to stay in until retirement, but they had no chance of promotion beyond their current rank (MSgts). One did eventually drop the weight, the other just retired and went on his way.

[AF_MSgt]

They're very serious about it where I'm at. In my Group, there's been 2 NCOs and 1 Amn that's lost a stripe this year and we have a SSgt that's about 2 weeks from getting the boot.

It's taken 6 years, but they're finally putting teeth behind the program.

[Shrike]

I saw more people booted for failure to comply with the WMP back in "the day" then I've seen for repeated PT failures.


<mandatory snide side comment> Hmmm, a program was already in place, and it worked. So what was the point of the new program?

;)

[LOAL-D]

I'd rather work with a smart butterball than a stupid skinny marathon runner.....

[Bummed]

I saw more people booted for failure to comply with the WMP back in "the day" then I've seen for repeated PT failures.


<mandatory snide side comment> Hmmm, a program was already in place, and it worked. So what was the point of the new program?

;)

Amen.
The draw-down really drove it home. Many were not allowed to reinlist.

Our tool crib MSgt couldn't retire quick enough. For months he strutted around blabbing about not caring about passing, not caring what "they" do to him, etc. After all, he was at 18-19 and his enlistment would take him past 20, so he wasn't worried. Well, it started with paperwork. That didn't work, and a stripe was next. He lost one and retired as a TSgt ASAP. It sent a message and people straightened up. And not only in the fitness area!

[Vince]

I had a peer and then a subordinate go through the old WMP...no sympathy from the Command where that was concerned. One month failure, verbal counseling from 1st Sgt. @d failure, written LOC, then LOR, then LOR/UIF, the Art15 and admin separation. Pretty simple and it worked in about 6 months time.

[WPNS]

One squadron has a TSgt who has been in 16 years, failed his pt test again, they took his Tech stripe, and since you fail, it's an auto referral, he won't be allowed to re-enlist right? anyway the point being, his current enlistment would take him to 19 years.... so....... does that mean he gets kicked out at 19 years because he won't be allowed to re-enlist? don't like him anyway and just plain told him, "Sucks to be you fat kid!"

[DHarris75]

The auto referral doesn't automatically mean he won't be able to reenlist. And a failure doesn't mean he will get a referral. Just if he has a failing score at the time his EPR closes out. Now, if he has failed enough to be demoted, than he may get a referral either way.

If he has a referral at the time his enlistment is up, than yeah - he wouldn't be able to reenlist. But if he logs another EPR that is not a referral prior to his enlistment being up, then he'd be able to reenlist.

That is not precluding any other issues or CC recommendation - just the referral issue.

But is he's already been demoted - so he better shape up or he will be out.

[CLSE]

I saw more people booted for failure to comply with the WMP back in "the day" then I've seen for repeated PT failures.


<mandatory snide side comment> Hmmm, a program was already in place, and it worked. So what was the point of the new program?

;)

To answer your comment - People were under the mandatory body fat requirements and passing their PT tests (bike or run), but they were still getting kicked out for being over the body weight limits.

Although, that would be an issue with the commanders, because, at least when I was on active duty and first joined the Guard, if you were over the body weight limits, you had to be taped. If you were under on the body fat, you were fine (the DoD reg actually says that people who are overweight, but still under the body fat requirements, are good, because that means they have more lean mass - funny how the Air Force ignores that little tidbit now).

Also, according to a report by a doc from the Air Force, the enlisted folks were getting kicked out more "regularly" than the commissioned folks.

About the original question, the Separation reg says that somebody who is over 16 has to be allowed to make 20 (unless he's a total turd).

Likewise, even for people under 20, the reg says that the commander should consider what amounts to a probationary period, and give the individual the chance to redeem himself, prior to recommending separation.