Recruiter misled students, a Navy investigation finds

[sigecaps]

A military recruiter accused of using false promises to lure two Kapolei students into enlisting in the Navy has been pulled off recruiting and given shipboard duty after a Navy investigation concluded he had misled the boys.

Partly in response to that case, Hawaii's public schools will no longer give student contact information and test scores on the Armed Services Vocational Aptitude Battery to recruiters unless students go to a recruiting station off campus and sign a form expressly requesting the information be given.

http://www.starbulletin.com/news/20090831_Recruiter_misled_students_a_Navy_investig ation_finds.html

The political fallout and discredit that this recruiter has single-handedly brought about in my home state is tremendous. How incredibly fucking stupid. He should be demoted to E-1 and dishonorably discharged.

[technomage1]

I think the case of the Marine recruiter in California who recruited the autistic kid with an IQ of 70 trumps this, but both are unsat.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=8080064&page=1

I know recruiting is important and difficult. Having said that, I do wonder if the current system of quotas is counterproductive. Shouldn't we concentrate on quality and not quantity so much?

[WILDJOKER5]

Really, he just lied about them being able to go to college BEFORE they go to sea? That was it? I am pretty sure there have been bigger lies from recruiters than this. These kids wanted something for nothing. And is the recruiter totally wrong? Cant people going for officer be put in college then sent to basic/OTS?

[Battleshort]

Questions...

Why are high schools giving the ASVAB and is it the norm now?

I took my ASVAB at the recruiting station.

Giving the political nature of the NEA, I wouldn't trust them to proctor the ASVAB.

[biddy1030]

Some schools make you take the ASVAB, i didnt have to, i only did it because i was joining but my wife had to take one in high school

[Gunner7]

Some schools make you take the ASVAB, i didnt have to, i only did it because i was joining but my wife had to take one in high school

I think schools that give the ASVAB check a box for some type of federal coin. Most of them would prefer to only have honest people like college recruiters stop by. That way parents can shell out mad money on junior's (who scored 12 on the ASVAB) college experiment. I think its funny the school would shut down all recruiting activity, must be based on the tried and true theory of sterotyping people by groups.

[CVal]

Questions...

Why are high schools giving the ASVAB and is it the norm now?

I took my ASVAB at the recruiting station.

Giving the political nature of the NEA, I wouldn't trust them to proctor the ASVAB.

The school where I work used to routinely give the ASVAB to sophomores. My eldest child took it in 2001-02, but three years later, my second child didn't. The school discontinued it due to wanting to spend more time on academics. I was not happy with that. I mean, I'm glad they want to focus on academics, but some students are better suited for the military rather than college and the ASVAB can point some students in the right direction.

As a point of parental pride, my eldest did so well, he didn't have to re-take the ASVAB when he enlisted in the Navy in 2004.

[Battleshort]

So the ASVAB's given in schools are not always valid for entry?

[CVal]

Battleshort: As for not trusting the NEA, if I remember correctly, it was a combination of military personnel and school personnel proctoring the test (I do remember having to proctor a section where my son was not sitting, although that was at my request).

[Gunner7]

So the ASVAB's given in schools are not always valid for entry?

It depends on how long ago the test was administered.

[Battleshort]

It still bothers me.

Why does a civillian school administer the ASVAB? I understand the $ incentive. What is the purpose of the school knowing how a student fairs on a military entrance exam?

[WILDJOKER5]

It still bothers me.

Why does a civillian school administer the ASVAB? I understand the $ incentive. What is the purpose of the school knowing how a student fairs on a military entrance exam?

When I went through, there was the ASVAB in the school and I dont think it was a highly publicised event. I can see a reason for the schools to exclude the mil from allowing student from taking the ASVAB in school even if they arnt given any $ from the gov. It is a standardize test as the SATs and ACTs. Neither of those tests are for the high schools benifit so why not allow the ASVAB? No the schools dont need to know the results of the test but the mil does and should eb sent off to a recruiter, why else would you take the test?

[Battleshort]

The article in the OP said:


Partly in response to that case, Hawaii's public schools will no longer give student contact information and test scores on the Armed Services Vocational Aptitude Battery to recruiters unless students go to a recruiting station off campus and sign a form expressly requesting the information be given.



Starting this year, however, no student information should go to recruiters through the ASVAB test because schools will no longer release it. In addition, students will no longer have to sign the Privacy Act statement on the test that is normally required by the military before tests are scored, Uyehara said. Now students will have to go to a recruiting office and sign a form if they wish to have their scores and contact information released to recruiters.


If the military is not involved, why even take it?


"We encourage students to take the ASVAB mainly for career exploration," she said. "It's a useful career tool, even if you don't want to go into the military, because it measures all of their strengths. It is the only test that really measures everything, including mechanical strengths."


If the military is not involved, who is counselling these kids on the results of their scores?

[Yggdrasil]

What a load of crap. Understand that the recruiter was really pulling a fast one, but I'm sure that we've all heard, and have probably been fed ourselves, lies and half-truths FAR worse than this one.

And truth is, what the recruiter said was actually a half-truth and not an outright lie. Depending on the rating that they choose, they may very well rarely - or even never - see a ship. Of course, anyone who flat out has a problem with going to sea shouldn't be joining the Navy in the first place.

I've seen Army and Air Force recruiting brochures that stated that it's 9-5 job.
I've seen Navy recruiting brochures that stated that you have a choice between drawing BAH or living on the ship/barracks (but mentioned nothing about marital status or rank).
I've seen Navy recruiting brochures that stated that there are bowling alleys on ships (which, out in the fleet, that's what we tell the FNG's to trick them into walking around the ship looking for it).

And these are BROCHURES, not something that's coming out of the recruiter's mouth!

Before deciding that this recruiter should burn, understand that you're probably in the military doing the very job you love because of a lie.

[Gunner7]

When I went through, there was the ASVAB in the school and I dont think it was a highly publicised event. I can see a reason for the schools to exclude the mil from allowing student from taking the ASVAB in school even if they arnt given any $ from the gov. It is a standardize test as the SATs and ACTs. Neither of those tests are for the high schools benifit so why not allow the ASVAB? No the schools dont need to know the results of the test but the mil does and should eb sent off to a recruiter, why else would you take the test?

In the interest of full disclosure..... besides meeting the schools requirement to conduct 2 national level tests (coin) the ASVAB is pitched to the schools as a wonderful way for students to gauge their aptitude in different areas. Mechanical and Electric are but two of them. Contrary to popular belief the US military is not in the career counseling/survey business and uses this "program" to identify men and women for potential service. When a group of seniors passes the test and indicate military interested you can bet every recruiter in that zone is working for an appointment. Those that indicate college bound are still worked but now the recruiter knows to pitch education benefits up front. Recruiting is a tough business and it would be nice if the applicants just walked in. Not so much when the majority of influencers in todays school system piss their pants when they hear a starters pistol.

[Gunner007]

Screw the whiney little shiites! These people were told flat out bald face lies that anyone with a computer can go online and find out about!

How about a more dastardly lie, how about something like: "You'll get free healthcare for you and your family with dental! Oh and if you retire after 20 you will continue to get free healthcare for the rest of your life!"

Ohhhhhhhhhhhh, wait a minute, that wasnt a lie at the time, it wasnt a lie until congress decided it wanted to experiment with tricare! Then suddenly all the recruiters who had told all of us this little story werent at fault because it wasnt in writing so therefore it wasnt promised by the recruiters! So was a 4 year full ride before going to sea written in blood on these kids contracts? The difference is when we were told free healthcare and dental for life it WAS actually the truth! Yet no one feels sorry for us do they?

[alaskaresident]

I lived in a small town and the nearest recruiter was 2 hours away. The recruiters came to the school on Saturdays and issued the test to those that wanted to take it. It was not required and your parents had to sign a letter stating that it was ok for you to take it.

[ringjamesa]

Questions...

Why are high schools giving the ASVAB and is it the norm now?

I took my ASVAB at the recruiting station.

Giving the political nature of the NEA, I wouldn't trust them to proctor the ASVAB.

High schools have always had the opportunity to allow students to take the ASVAB. MEPS sends their testing official out and elicits at least 2 military Recruiters to proctor the test (make sure the little bastards aren't cheating). Different schools do it differently. Some schools say whomever wants to take it may take it on this day at this time and everyone else has to go to class. Other schools only offer it to those students that are military interested. Other schools present it as an opportunity to see what areas a kid might excell in after high school


So the ASVAB's given in schools are not always valid for entry?

Not true. They are valid. However, they are only valid for 2 years so if they took it in 10th grade... Most schools administer it to Juniors and/or Seniors.

[Battleshort]

Thanks Ring.

[Seasons]

Anybody notice how the recruiter in this issue was previously banned from recruiting on that high school's grounds for his behavoir?

[Battleshort]

Anyone notice that they dumped him on a ship? Should've let him hand out basketballs at the base gym.

(or facility wellness center if you don't know what a base gym is):D

[WILDJOKER5]

Anybody notice how the recruiter in this issue was previously banned from recruiting on that high school's grounds for his behavoir?

Might have been picking up on all those chicks "interested" in the navy life.

[ringjamesa]

It still bothers me.

Why does a civillian school administer the ASVAB? I understand the $ incentive. What is the purpose of the school knowing how a student fairs on a military entrance exam?

Believe it or not MEPS actually "sells" the ASVAB to the school. Not as in exchanging $ but as in convincing schools to allow their students to tes. The way they do this is presenting the test not so much as a military entrance exam (which it obviously is) but as a career guidance tool-tells the students what they might be good at. The reason for that is that schools have less and less unscheduled time and to get in the door, you have to provide a "what's in it for me?" justification. Why would you want to test in schools you may ask? Well to get kids like me. I took the test to get out of class. had no interest in the military, got a couple of calls from Recruiters and 14 years later.... Besides, it helps Recruiters sort through the school lists-if you can cut off 20-50% of the student population your target market just got a little more targeted (it depends upon the school but a lot of kids out there can't pass the ASVAB).

[Silver Fox]

Damn makes me wish I'd filed against my recruiter.

Seriously, whose recruiter DIDN'T lie to them?