Potential recruits an "alien force'

[CommunityEditor]

Today’s civilian pool of potential sailors is made up of “narcissistic praise junkies” and constitutes an “alien life force” to older Navy recruiters, according to a presentation on selling the Navy to the so-called “millennial” generation — people born in the mid- and late 1980s now in their late teens and early 20s.

The presentation was part of the Annual Navy Workforce Research and Analysis Conference at the Naval Postgraduate School in Monterey, Calif., which addressed a wide array of recruitment and retention matters.

Potential Navy recruits are “coddled” and “unrealistically impatient,” the presentation says, and would “expect an open and transparent environment” if they enlisted. It also advises commanders to expect young people linked together by the Web and cell phones to “share their Navy experiences” and that “some of them may not be worth bragging about.”

In another set of slides, the Navy reports the effect that the Iraq war has had on recruitment: Survey results from 2003 juxtaposed with 2007 indicate a spike in young people who call themselves “less patriotic” and “less likely to join the military.” The vast majority of youths in the Navy’s target recruiting range — almost 90 percent — say they want to go to college, not join the military.


Article: http://www.navytimes.com/news/2007/0...ation_070928w/
PowerPoint deck: http://www.sm.nps.navy.mil/nwc/07/Pl...ation deck.ppt

Young people should want to go to college. Does this really hurt the Navy? The Navy is seeking to "re-shape" itself into a leaner, smarter force. Instead of constantly seeking uneducated, 18-21 males, there should be a greater effort to find people who are learning trades outside the CNET system. Pay those people who have proven themselves to be motivated to get their education and qualifications to man the next generation ships. Find the best and the brightest, compensate them, take care of them while they are employed, then make sure they are not forgotten when they are discharged.

The Navy is wasting a lot of money on filling quotas rather than concentrating on finding quality recruits for their programs. SPECOPS has done a better job in recruiting, the rest of the fleet needs to change their methods.

[Measure Man]

Originally Posted by CommunityEditor

Today’s civilian pool of potential sailors is made up of “narcissistic praise junkies” and constitutes an “alien life force” to older Navy recruiters, according to a presentation on selling the Navy to the so-called “millennial” generation — people born in the mid- and late 1980s now in their late teens and early 20s.

Wow...a generation gap, imagine that. Older folks have been saying things like this about the "kids of today" since...oh, at least back to Socrates.

The presentation was part of the Annual Navy Workforce Research and Analysis Conference at the Naval Postgraduate School in Monterey, Calif., which addressed a wide array of recruitment and retention matters.

Potential Navy recruits are “coddled” and “unrealistically impatient,” the presentation says, and would “expect an open and transparent environment” if they enlisted.

This is almost comical. "We just don't know what to do with these kids today...they expect explanations and answers."

It also advises commanders to expect young people linked together by the Web and cell phones to “share their Navy experiences” and that “some of them may not be worth bragging about.”

So, what you're saying is you don't want recruits to hear anything other than the official sales pitch about your product.

Would you buy a Ford if they were complaining about potential customers talking to previous Ford owners? You are practically admitting here that the Navy is not what you say it is.

In another set of slides, the Navy reports the effect that the Iraq war has had on recruitment: Survey results from 2003 juxtaposed with 2007 indicate a spike in young people who call themselves “less patriotic” and “less likely to join the military.” The vast majority of youths in the Navy’s target recruiting range — almost 90 percent — say they want to go to college, not join the military.

Agree that kids wanting to go to college is a good thing. How does the Navy see this as a bad thing? Yes, being self-described as "less patriotic" is an issue...mostly because of the way the word "patriotic" has been bastardized over the past 5 years or so.


Article: http://www.navytimes.com/news/2007/0...ation_070928w/
PowerPoint deck: http://www.sm.nps.navy.mil/nwc/07/Pl...ation deck.ppt[/quote]

[The Universal Curmudgeon_guest]

Originally Posted by CommunityEditor

The vast majority of youths in the Navy’s target recruiting range — almost 90 percent — say they want to go to college, not join the military.

I don't suppose that that has the slightest bit to do with the fact that no one appears to be "selling" the military as an actual career where you actually get to do interesting things and actually get rewarded for doing your job in an exemplary manner, does it?

Maybe it's only my cynicism, but what I have seen sure makes it appear that the military has "maintained standards of excellence in job performance" by making the job so simple that it takes a really dedicated screwup NOT to do well. (i.e. [and, yes I know that I am "exagerating for the sake of emphasis"] changing the taskings of a "Vehicle Mechanic" so that it is now done by a "Mechanic, Vehicle, Wheel, Front, Right", a "Mechanic, Vehicle, Wheel, Front, Left", a "Mechanic, Vehicle, Wheel, Rear, Right", a "Mechanic, Vehicle, Wheel, Rear, Left", all the way through to a "Mechanic, Vehicle, Exhaust, Pipe".)

[Measure Man]

Originally Posted by The Universal Curmudgeon_guest

I don't suppose that that has the slightest bit to do with the fact that no one appears to be "selling" the military as an actual career where you actually get to do interesting things and actually get rewarded for doing your job in an exemplary manner, does it?

Maybe it's only my cynicism, but what I have seen sure makes it appear that the military has "maintained standards of excellence in job performance" by making the job so simple that it takes a really dedicated screwup NOT to do well. (i.e. [and, yes I know that I am "exagerating for the sake of emphasis"] changing the taskings of a "Vehicle Mechanic" so that it is now done by a "Mechanic, Vehicle, Wheel, Front, Right", a "Mechanic, Vehicle, Wheel, Front, Left", a "Mechanic, Vehicle, Wheel, Rear, Right", a "Mechanic, Vehicle, Wheel, Rear, Left", all the way through to a "Mechanic, Vehicle, Exhaust, Pipe".)

Not sure that is true...at least not in the Air Force.

Our latest trend is to reduce AFSCs by combining into more generic specialties. For example, Personnel, Service and Manpower combining into one speciality.

While this is probably good in some career fields, in others it isn't. It really depends on the depth of knowledge involved...weighing breadth of speciality knowledge vs. depth of knowledge on particular tasks.

NOt that any of that has anything to do with this topic ...but you brought it up :-)

Okay...something on topic:

The "linked together by internet and cell phones" bit. Hey, these are just the new media. The job of any advertiser will be to exploit the new media to reach your target audience. I wasn't around in the 50s...but makes me wonder if this presentation back then would lament the fact that kids expected a moving, talking, presentation vs. the posters of the 40s. I'm quite sure the older generation at that time probably criticized the younger generation (of potential recruits) as not having their same sense of patriotism, being "coddled and unrealistically impatient."

I think the presentations author...is maybe just getting old and technology and times are passing him by. It does not appear to be a meaningful generational gap analysis...but just a "the kids of today will be the ruin of us all" which again...every generation has spouted since Socrates.

[Measure Man]

Okay...I just saw that the actual presentation was posted in this thread also.

I take back what I said about the presenter. It was a good and insightful presentation...the author of the article just picked out the 2 or 3 worse comments and made that sound like the tone of the presentation...which is not at all what it was.

Lesson learned about the "tone" of the article vs. reality. Wow, there has been a few of those lately, huh.

What's comical about the whole thing is that the presentation explains that young people today are linked in, spend a lot of time on the Internet, etc. -- and then the Navy puts online and makes easy to find a PowerPoint that insults them! If I were an 18 year-old kid and I saw all these blog posts and news stories about how the Navy thinks I'm scatter-brained, "coddled," and "narcissistic," why would I even consider enlisting? And I'll go you one more -- the Navy can say all this stuff about how its Baby Boomer senior officers will never understand today's youth, but take a look at any of the casualty reports coming out of Iraq and Afghanistan: Most of the people joining, fighting and dying in our wars today are in their late teens and early twenties. Clearly, many of them were able to actually put down their mobile phones long enough to go fight for this nation.

First let me say that I am a retired IS1. I tried to get my 18 year old son into the Navy. He was excited about going in and had scored high on the ASVAB. I explained that the end of September was the worst time to go in but he was convinced by a Chief in the recruiting station and a PO2 (SW) that it was the best time for him to go in. They took him over to MEPS and the next thing you kow he was signed for a job that he was not interested ini but was told that that was all the rating that were available because it was the end of the Fiscal year. He would not have been able to go in anyway until 6 months later when he finished high school. Instead of the recruiter doing what was best for the recruit they were trying to "up their numbers" as they always do. My son Cancelled his contract and now has a very bitter feeling toward the Navy. Your older generation in the service has nothing to do with why the kids today don't want to go in it is that the kids today are smart enough to see through the Recruiting BS. Learn to be honest with people and then they won;t have any false expectations!

There's a sad bit of truth in the presentation. It's my opinion that some time in the Navy could really help a young person, it did me. Many of the management techniques I learned or invented have served me very well in my civilian job.

That said, I have to say that the Navy handles it personnel matters (recruiting, job placement, assignment, promotion) worse than any organization I've ever seen. There are many lost opportunities when really bright motivated people are treated poorly just so some dummy can "make goal". I've seen the Navy build people and completely de-motivate really impressive people. It's really sad to watch the latter!

I was in the Navy for 10 years, made Chief in 8, left after going to Iraq and being mistreated by my last command due to some "good ol' boy" politics. I used to tell my Sailors, "Just do your job well and you'll be taken care of". That worked well for me for most of my career and I truly believed it. I apologized to them when we were all given terrible evals so that friends of the ranker could get the coveted "EP's". At 10 years, it was pretty easy to say "I can do better than this." And I did. I had nothing to lose and much to gain. The Navy lost an experienced, technically skilled CPO, that they easily could have kept with the slightest effort. I walked right into a great job and tripled my income. I'd seen this over and over with other Sailors and especially officers, but never expected this to be how my career would end.

Other policy blunders include requiring college degrees for CPO's. Some motivated people don't do well in schools, and we've just told them to go elsewhere. I met Terry Scott, who I believe had a lot to do with this, and I left really disappointed. He came across to me as a shallow politician, and this was a political move. It will not serve the Navy well. I guess it's much easier to verify that "tickets are punched" than to recognize and reward actual sustained superior performance.

For all the blustering and talk of "Leadership", a Sailors career success can really be a crap shoot, based on who you work for and how much they (don't) care. Enlisted people can now forget about learning anything technical in the Navy because they're outsourcing it all to big contractors, leaving only the drudgery and danger to Sailors. That's tough to sell to anybody, especially todays kids.

Kids talk. A lot. And they'll share there experiences, good and bad, with anybody who'll listen. The organization needs to be professional and 100% honest with potential recruits and old salts alike, 100% of the time.

[ringjamesa]

I have been recruiting for a little while now and am no longer as young as I once was. With that said, there is a lot to be said for listening to your applicant and then giving an honest answer. If they are interested, great. If not, why the hell would I want to put them into my beloved AF? A fact that every recruiter needs to learn is that not everyone that is qualified wants to be in the military and not everyone that wants to be in the military is qualified. You need to strike that balance. There are still kids out there that don't know much about the military. They are smart enought that if you give them the information and the percieved benifits outweigh the percieved costs, they will join. That is where listening comes in. You have to know what they want. I can tell you that as a Sr in H.S., I had no intention of joining any branch of the Armed Forces and I have now been affilliated for over 12 years.