We don't want US troops in my country!

[close_guantanamo]

Hi,
I live in Germany, very close to the Coleman Barracks in Mannheim, where the US military have their only official prison in Germany. You know, a few years ago, I really liked the USA. I thought it's maybe not as nice as Germany, but a free constitutional democracy where people can feel safe. A country which adheres to international treaties and behaves civilized like all other western countries. When the first pictures of Abu Graib came, I was shocked and appalled, but I still believed it's just some bad apples. But the more reports and pictures came, and when I learned about the Auschwitz-like horrible torture camp Guantanamo, the more I realized that's it's not more than some bad apples. I realized the USA don't give a shit for human rights or democracy and uses torture regularly to get what they want. Now I despise the US-government and their military. And I do hate the soldiers who actually did it with all my heart. And thinking of the Arab prisoners who were kidnapped by US troops and taken to the Coleman Barracks to be tortured too (like the German prosecution found out), I feel like throwing up. Each time I pass that gruesome place, I almost cry thinking of those poor prisoners these animals are mistreating now. Now, when I see the US-flag which stands for torture, war and inhumanity, I feel deeply appalled. When I see it burn on TV, I feel satisfaction. I can't wait for the day your troops leave my country. You're not welcome here. Shame on you and all US troops, because every one of you who stays in a military that acts against human rights and commits the most horrible atrocities, is guilty too. I pray that Jesus will punish you all. Shame on you.
Regina Freitag

[Mysykt]

Wow! Bitter much? Saying that ALL US military personell are bad is the same as saying all Germans supported Hitler until the Allied forces came in to save your butts. Get a grip! We only bite back once we have been attacked... and as far as human rights violations go... why don't you look at your own country's history before judging mine.

[SgtMac6]

And how many people did Germany kill,torture,maim,rape and do experimental surgries on? Seems like the only reason you have the right to sound off is because we saved your A.. Thanks for your support, this American will remember.

[milligal]

Does a country's treatment of the civil rights of prisoners during war represent that country's role in civil rights in every area?

Admittedly, our nation finds controversy internationally regarding the treatment of prisoners. It is easy to lash back at your statement and recall the history of Germany, however those outside the US would do well to realize that a country's military action during a time of war does not represent that country's stand on civil rights in the free world.

America has always stood for civil rights and has promoted the rights of those who have been oppressed throughout history. With that being said, it is fare to go further and say that many Americans oppose the treatment of prisoners in the instances you have quoted. No country is perfect-as you find imperfections in your own country's past, it is what we try to be, what we aspire to be that dictates our reputation on the world scene.

I am proud of my country for providing freedom and pursuit of happiness that has yet to be replicated by any other country in the world.

[WilleyeBMarine?]

Tell your Army not to say hateful gestures about African- American males. Take care of your Army first, we're not going to do it again. By the way, you just probably made 10 people want to join the Army.

[Measure Man]

Hi,
I live in Germany, very close to the Coleman Barracks in Mannheim, where the US military have their only official prison in Germany. You know, a few years ago, I really liked the USA. I thought it's maybe not as nice as Germany, but a free constitutional democracy where people can feel safe. A country which adheres to international treaties and behaves civilized like all other western countries. When the first pictures of Abu Graib came, I was shocked and appalled, but I still believed it's just some bad apples. But the more reports and pictures came, and when I learned about the Auschwitz-like horrible torture camp Guantanamo, the more I realized that's it's not more than some bad apples. I realized the USA don't give a shit for human rights or democracy and uses torture regularly to get what they want. Now I despise the US-government and their military. And I do hate the soldiers who actually did it with all my heart. And thinking of the Arab prisoners who were kidnapped by US troops and taken to the Coleman Barracks to be tortured too (like the German prosecution found out), I feel like throwing up. Each time I pass that gruesome place, I almost cry thinking of those poor prisoners these animals are mistreating now. Now, when I see the US-flag which stands for torture, war and inhumanity, I feel deeply appalled. When I see it burn on TV, I feel satisfaction. I can't wait for the day your troops leave my country. You're not welcome here. Shame on you and all US troops, because every one of you who stays in a military that acts against human rights and commits the most horrible atrocities, is guilty too. I pray that Jesus will punish you all. Shame on you.
Regina Freitag


Frau Freitag,

Americans are equally appalled. How do you think you learned of these places? it is Americans that exposed these atrocities. Americans that investigated. American's that prosecuted the guilty. The US Flag stands for liberty, justice and freedom for all. Most other countries would have simply denied the accusations internationally and tried to cover it up.

It is the greatness of America that can continue to stand because we are not afraid to publicize our own shortcomings and commit to repairing the harm. Perhaps you would prefer to have an opressed media that would only report good news about it's government so you could sleep better at night in not knowing of atrocities...but that is not what we do. This is the reason for one of our basic rights called "Freedom of the Press"...was to be able to feely criticize the government. Many don't have that.

War is ugly business...and a lot of ugliness comes of it. Yes, decent people are appalled as they should be...but this type of activity is absolutely not what our country stands for, which is evidenced by our prosecution of the offenders. Believe that.

Most of us stay in the military to continue to fight for freedom, liberty and justice. If those of us who stood for civil rights left the military...who would be remaining? Then you might really have what you claim is the case...so how dare you pray for punishment on those willing to stay and contribute...pray for the victory of the thousands of committed Soldiers, Sailors, Airmen and Marines who believe in freedom and human rights.

How dare you! You really should be ashamed of yourself. Your heart bleeds for the "innocent" Arabs, but you condemn the innocent Americans. Shame on you!

[ibanezrg520kid]

[QUOTE=close_guantanamo;47287I pray that Jesus will punish you all. Shame on you.
Regina Freitag[/QUOTE]

typical hypocritial religious person *rollseyes* if you truely believe in jesus, you would be the want at the blunt end of the stick in this situation. idk what bible you are reading, but it must have been written by and idiot like yourself.

PS. thanks germany for the nickname Devil Dog, the marines really like it!!

you know, i spent some time living in germany, and i met more racists and more people who discriminate then i have ever met in america. I met people who were more vulgar and shouted extremely rude sexual things at my twin little sisters (14 at the time) and my girlfriend who was a latin girl who grew up in germany. it happened more in my time in germany than it has ever happened here in the US. i met more pepole who discriminate against religion then i have ever met here in the states. BUT YOU KNOW WHAT? i'm not going online critizing a group as a whole for a MINORITIES actions. you act like EVERYONE is doing these atrocities, but they aren't. you are close minded and will not look at the bigger picture. now, maybe i should go around and start bad mouthing every german... but then i'd just be stooping to your level, and i carry myself with more pride then that.

[TJMAC77SP]

This one smells of a 'granade over the wall' posting. Say something sure to get everyone hopping mad and sit back and watch.................amazing what some people find entertaining. There are so many references regarding Germany's long history of mass violence that this thread could go on forever.

[bowenj10]

As I said in my previous post. This was solely intended to piss people off and get them firing back...

While I agree with you that it probably was a troll and that it was posted as a piece to incite anger, I can't help but be astounded at the vacuous responses. American history should be taught at every level in elementary and secondary schools in our country. It should also be a part of every training day in the military. That people don't realize that our country has been responsible for some of the worst crimes against humanity in recent history amazes me. That military members don't know about military history amazes me even more. I would certainly suggest that some of the members of this website go to their local library and pick up a book once in a while.

[ames]

ok, I'm not really sure what the government and the troops decsions are...or at least all of them. But I do know this. Americans do not agree with EVERY decision the government and the military makes. Therefore, not all areas are the same. This is exactly why we are fighting now. No one knows how to get along because every one loves to throw fighting words. Please do not take part in this..you are only adding to the choas that already exists.

[bowenj10]

I certainly have no intentions of defending the OP's viewpoints. My point was that there seems to be a high level of ignorance of American history among the people who frequent these boards. If someone wants to oppose a viewpoint, however absurd and offensive it may be, they should do so by using facts and logic rather than ignorance and emotion. An opposing argument will be much more convincing when based upon facts and logic and far easier to discredit when based upon ignorance and emotion.

But, for the sake of helping to kill this thread, I will make this my last post here.

[ames]

-bowen
I'm sorry...my post wasn't directed towards you. It was for the guy who had originally posted here...and for the ones who were fighting back with him/her. :) Sorry, I'm new here..>I should have made that clearer.

[duder]

Wow, this reminds me of Charles DeGualle telling Eisenhower he wanted all American troops out of France after WWII. Ike's response? "It will take a while to dig up the bodies."

[Chateauroux]

Say want you want about Charles DeGualle, duder BUT unlike the Monkey, he knew a losing war when he had one on his hands. He ended the quagmire in Algeria that was bleeding France white. He also run the American military out of France, closing their bases in the early 60s. I always liked Charlie. ;)

[maggiemayk]

germans like that make me mad. they had no problem while we were rebuilding their country with our money, while their women marry our troops just to get into america or killing thousands of Jewish persons.
so that is just fine how about we believe that all germans are evil and should be put to death due to the atrocities committed by your countryman named "HITLER".
lastly never accuse an american soldier of anything until you have walked a mile in his shoes, walked in the desert sand like him (her), protected a country where the citizens would rather kill them than accept their help. i spent 2 yrs living in your country and was given dirty looks and told to go home more times than i care to remember. yet when ou marry our men and come here you are treated as an equal and smiled at and welcomed.
SHAME ON YOU!! get into reality and think of what the prisoners have done to the USA to piss off the soldier.

[TJMAC77SP]

Say want you want about Charles DeGualle, duder BUT unlike the Monkey, he knew a losing war when he had one on his hands. He ended the quagmire in Algeria that was bleeding France white. He also run the American military out of France, closing their bases in the early 60s. I always liked Charlie. ;)

I don't speak French so can you tell me what Chateauroux means in French?

[Myers11bTOG]

This is obviously intended to get responses. But the fact that the author would stoop to insulting every aspect that we hold dear is just going to far. i would advise Regina Freitag to do some research and stop judging an entire nation based on a few things she saw in the media. Also keep in mind that these prisoners are people who are responsible for for the murder of thousands of American people. those that don't serve on the front and see the IEDs killing their friends and fellow soldiers should really keep their simple minded ignorant opinions to themselves lest they be set strait and their overactive emotions hurt.

[Mrs_SFC_Piteo]

If we are all aware that this message's intent was to provoke a response, why are we humoring this hypocrisy? You know what we stand for, I know what we stand for, so why should someone's ignorance bother us so much? This world is full of people who choose not to educate themselves. Nothing you or I can say will make these people open their eyes, a newspaper, or a book. Let them live in their "ignorance is bliss" life. We KNOW who we are!

[oh come on now]

Sounds like you succeeded in getting a lot of people worked up over your posting. It is your opinion and your perrogative to think and say what you want regarding the US. I do think though that if you read some of the previous replies to your posting with less emotion, you may find that some of what they're saying makes sense. Maybe not, but I honestly think your rationalizations are too emotional to be logical. While it is a shame that sometimes innocent people suffer, no war is pretty...not in history...not now. While it is good to have passion over what you believe, you want to make sure you can tell a distinction between that and being a closed minded radical. Hardening your heart towards an entire nation is a big personal conviction.

[jay_ellis04]

Well, if your grandfather had been a better man, we wouldn't be there. If 60 years ago, you hadn't raped, pillaged, tortured and burned the majority of Europe, we wouldn't be there.

[OGMIDDRIDER]

I see what you think. If you are correct, then Germany needs to defend and provide all of its own OIL/COAL needs domestically. Or, if you need foreign oil, defend that supply via UN or International Treaties-sanctions via "NO STRONG ARM ACTIONS". Get my meaning?

Shame on you. Jesus is not your lackey. Do you own dirt work. You may have lived in isolation too long, I was born before D-Day. If you do not know this expression, go look it up.

In 1935 U.S. Congress Peanut head politicians (the U.S. Congress was full of these guys that thought that the Ocean was "big enough to keep war away) and the remainder of the world was even more polluted with peanut heads all causing WW2. Years before 1944 the politicians said "we will use negotiation" to settle our differences. Thousands of Americans died on the Normandy beaches that day, all because politicians did not and do not today understand that War Fighting (the result of simple minded politicians failures) is about killing. So, failed negotiations always leads to brutal killing. Or, the second alternative is "do without oil".

Our foreign dependance on oil is nothing compared to where the World will be if some dictator blackmails me over food (because my nation converted food production over to energy production $$-green). People may go without oil for weeks. People can not go long without food. Especially the children.

Look at the U.N's "sanctions and the Oil-for-Food deal on Iraq before March 2003. World-Politicians vision of problem solving. What a joke. All this did was make a few rich, and many dead Iraq children because the lack of proper food and medicine. The Iraq dictator at the time thought more of his "palace construction" then the children of his country. How do sanctions fix any problem without hurting those that are unable to defend themselves?? Look at North Korea. This is always the course of sanctions. And today right here in the United States of America, polititions are saying "more sanctions and less war".

All in all, have a nice day.

[fenway]

first of all American elected Obama ( I didn't vote for him) but that would never happen in germany

a flag and soldiers are just a part of the country not the end all. By the reasoning of the poster, I could say that all germans are Nazi's ... forever.

also, If Europe gets serious about security we might not be paranoid

[Cajun's Girl]

Wow I never seen this thread before, what the hell!

Righto, point being that you can't judge a country by the actions of a few from that country. We could all find a reason to hate another country in that case. It is just silly to hate a country based on a few idiots that make the news.

[TJMAC77SP]

Come on folks this thread is pretty old and it was a grenade (http://www.militarytimes.com/forums/showpost.php?p=48745&postcount=8)to begin with...............

[Bruce]

I wonder if the original poster, Rita, is old enough to remember the West German government's reaction to the Red Army Faction during the 1970s, and how "humanely" it responded to terrorism. I speak of the hijacking of Lufthansa Flight 181 in 1977 by four Arab terrorists who demanded, among other things, the release of 11 Red Army Faction terrorists in German jails. In the end, West German commandos attacked the hijacked airliner, killing all of the hijackers. By the next morning, it was reported that 3 of the 11 prisoners had committed suicide. Red Army Faction leader Andreas Baader died of a "self-inflicted" gunshot wound to the back of his head. Gudrun Ensellin was found hanged in his cell. Jan-Carl Raspe also suffered from a "self-inflicted gunshot" wound from which he died the next day. A fourth prisoner, Irmgard Möller, survived four stab wounds near her heart, also as part of a suicide strategy, according to the Government. Möller claimed that her suicide "attempt" and the deaths of the others were extra-judicial punishment by the West German government in response to the hijacking and a related kidnapping. Her explanation is plausible: how could these people have had access to guns and knives in jail? How does someone stab themselves near the heart four times? Some might say that America's prosecution of the war on terrorism should have been as nasty as that of the West Germans. Ultimately, I think that the days of U.S. torture of terrorist suspects, if it ever happened, is over. As for the Germans ... well, who knows?

[becca72]

Hi,
I live in Germany, very close to the Coleman Barracks in Mannheim, where the US military have their only official prison in Germany. You know, a few years ago, I really liked the USA. I thought it's maybe not as nice as Germany, but a free constitutional democracy where people can feel safe. A country which adheres to international treaties and behaves civilized like all other western countries. When the first pictures of Abu Graib came, I was shocked and appalled, but I still believed it's just some bad apples. But the more reports and pictures came, and when I learned about the Auschwitz-like horrible torture camp Guantanamo, the more I realized that's it's not more than some bad apples. I realized the USA don't give a shit for human rights or democracy and uses torture regularly to get what they want. Now I despise the US-government and their military. And I do hate the soldiers who actually did it with all my heart. And thinking of the Arab prisoners who were kidnapped by US troops and taken to the Coleman Barracks to be tortured too (like the German prosecution found out), I feel like throwing up. Each time I pass that gruesome place, I almost cry thinking of those poor prisoners these animals are mistreating now. Now, when I see the US-flag which stands for torture, war and inhumanity, I feel deeply appalled. When I see it burn on TV, I feel satisfaction. I can't wait for the day your troops leave my country. You're not welcome here. Shame on you and all US troops, because every one of you who stays in a military that acts against human rights and commits the most horrible atrocities, is guilty too. I pray that Jesus will punish you all. Shame on you.
Regina Freitag


This post and others after are somewhat disturbing.
The reality is that EVERY COUNTRY has things in their history that they wish they could change or could have done differently. GERMANY, my dear niave blogger, is certainly at the top of the list. So the next time you bash a nation for its past sins, please do your due dilligence and pause for a moment. Remember the millions of JEWS that your nation tortured, raped, murdered and killed for NO REASON other than the fact that they were JEWS. For you to rant and rave about the "horrible atrocities" that you say "ALL US TROOPS" who stay in the military take part in, is purely ignorant. It is the pot calling the kettle black, plain and simple. So the next time you run your mouth about something as clearly hypocritical as this, do everyone a favor and keep it closed.
The US has done some awful things and as a US citizens and military person, I admonish those acts and if found guilty the appropriate people should be held accountable, absolutely! But because my husband wears his uniform proudly and because I did doesnt give you the right to assume we are horrible people.

Your a German citizen, should I look at you and assume your a Nazi?
Think before you post next time!

[NeWSoldiEr08]

Hi,
I live in Germany, very close to the Coleman Barracks in Mannheim, where the US military have their only official prison in Germany. You know, a few years ago, I really liked the USA. I thought it's maybe not as nice as Germany, but a free constitutional democracy where people can feel safe. A country which adheres to international treaties and behaves civilized like all other western countries. When the first pictures of Abu Graib came, I was shocked and appalled, but I still believed it's just some bad apples. But the more reports and pictures came, and when I learned about the Auschwitz-like horrible torture camp Guantanamo, the more I realized that's it's not more than some bad apples. I realized the USA don't give a shit for human rights or democracy and uses torture regularly to get what they want. Now I despise the US-government and their military. And I do hate the soldiers who actually did it with all my heart. And thinking of the Arab prisoners who were kidnapped by US troops and taken to the Coleman Barracks to be tortured too (like the German prosecution found out), I feel like throwing up. Each time I pass that gruesome place, I almost cry thinking of those poor prisoners these animals are mistreating now. Now, when I see the US-flag which stands for torture, war and inhumanity, I feel deeply appalled. When I see it burn on TV, I feel satisfaction. I can't wait for the day your troops leave my country. You're not welcome here. Shame on you and all US troops, because every one of you who stays in a military that acts against human rights and commits the most horrible atrocities, is guilty too. I pray that Jesus will punish you all. Shame on you.
Regina Freitag

:::runbs hands together:::

Everytime i read a history book (and believe me i love history) your country sticks out as the most brutal hateful country of all time, maybe not now..but you have a history everytime i think german i think death and mayhem now, maybe JUST MAYBE if your history would have not been so vile you wouldnt have US troops to deal with in the first place, but since one of your former leaders bungie jumped off the deep end you have our troops in your country because we the british and the russians saved your ass. so deal with it, as far as torture, you are wrong there are bad apples the entire military isnt like that, and kidnapping innocent arabs??? LOL!!!! i wont even dive into that shit

[becca72]

LOL....exactly.... ;)
What else is there to do ....lol

[Smeghead]

Everytime i read a history book (and believe me i love history) your country sticks out as the most brutal hateful country of all time, maybe not now..but you have a history everytime i think german i think death and mayhem

Actually, I think Britain holds that title.

[TJMAC77SP]

god for bid i pay attention to original post dates..if its still being posted in its still an active thread :rolleyes:

As I said, that is cool but you are holding a debate where one party has left the building. Have at it.

[DDNIGHT]

You guys are wasting your time:

----------------------------------------------------------

PROFILE INFO FOR "close_guantanamo"

Join Date: 05-31-2007
PostsTotal Posts: 1 (0.00 posts per day)

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Just a frickin' loser blowing off steam......damn Nazis....

[TheHarleyMan2]

Hey maybe I HAVE a SOLUTION, Why don't YOUR NATIONALS as well as OTHER FOREIGN NATIONALS, and ILLEGALS GET OUT OF MY COUNTRY AND QUIT GETTING HANDOUTS THAT MY TAX DOLLARS and MY GOVERNMENT PAY FOR!

If I was President I would get rid of WELFARE, I would pass a LAW MAKING IT MANDATORY for EVERY LEGAL AMERICAN to OWN at least 5 guns with PLENTY OF AMMO, I WOULD MAKE IT LEGAL TO CARRY ANYWHERE, I WOULD SEAL OFF THE BORDERS, I WOULDN'T TAKE SH!T FROM ANY COUNTRY MUCH LESS GIVE IN TO THEM! I would use the money for the STIMULUS PLAN and OTHER FUNDS going to build and support OTHER foreign countries and use that money to GIVE EACH HARD WORKING AMERICAN between the ages of 25 and 60 years of age $150,000.00 each to pay their bills, etc and it would put money back into our OWN ECONOMY! Plus, I WOULD SEVERILY PENILIZE, (SHUT THEM DOWN and BOYCOT THEM from bringing their products into the USA) ANY CORPORATION who would move their plants outside the USA and HIRE ILLEGALS to work for them!
We NEED THIS TO HAPPEN TO SAVE THE USA, the economy, and the AMERICAN PEOPLE!

[Jaimie809]

Uh, excuse me, i dont know why im taking this to heart, but im an AMERICAN soldier, and so was my father, and for you the have the audacity to even say we are heartless ANIMALS, just upsets me. Im not pointing fingers and trying to start anything but lets see here, wasn't it the GERMANS who were awful to the Jews, but i mean, whatever, that was the PAST, right? It should MATTER?? well this matters to me, this thread should be deleted how DARE you insult Americans and their Troops when we have people dying everyday, and familes torn apart everyday because we were ATTACKED on our own soil. So dont you DARE even insult us and think you wont catch hell for it, all i can say is God have Mercey on your soul for the words you said, and Shame on you!

[Silver Fox]

Sensationalist crap.

Abu Ghraib and Gitmo have been responsible for some bad things, it's disney land compared to your country's concentration camps that slaughtered 6 million people.

Let's keep it in perspective, ok?

And you saying every American soldier is responsible for Guantanamo Bay and Abu Ghraib abuse is like saying every German soldier is responsible for the Holocaust.

Back to the drawing board for you.

[eichampt1]

Hi,
I live in Germany, very close to the Coleman Barracks in Mannheim, where the US military have their only official prison in Germany. You know, a few years ago, I really liked the USA. I thought it's maybe not as nice as Germany, but a free constitutional democracy where people can feel safe. A country which adheres to international treaties and behaves civilized like all other western countries. When the first pictures of Abu Graib came, I was shocked and appalled, but I still believed it's just some bad apples. But the more reports and pictures came, and when I learned about the Auschwitz-like horrible torture camp Guantanamo, the more I realized that's it's not more than some bad apples. I realized the USA don't give a shit for human rights or democracy and uses torture regularly to get what they want. Now I despise the US-government and their military. And I do hate the soldiers who actually did it with all my heart. And thinking of the Arab prisoners who were kidnapped by US troops and taken to the Coleman Barracks to be tortured too (like the German prosecution found out), I feel like throwing up. Each time I pass that gruesome place, I almost cry thinking of those poor prisoners these animals are mistreating now. Now, when I see the US-flag which stands for torture, war and inhumanity, I feel deeply appalled. When I see it burn on TV, I feel satisfaction. I can't wait for the day your troops leave my country. You're not welcome here. Shame on you and all US troops, because every one of you who stays in a military that acts against human rights and commits the most horrible atrocities, is guilty too. I pray that Jesus will punish you all. Shame on you.
Regina Freitag

Do you mean like DACHAU, BIRKENWALD, AUSCHWITZ, ETC, ETC.....? Have we killed 6 million people yet?

[eichampt1]

Do you mean like DACHAU, BIRKENWALD, AUSCHWITZ, ETC, ETC.....? Have we killed 6 million people yet?

Sorry, that's Buchenwald and... Dachau, Sachsenhausen, Buchenwald, Flossenbürg, Mauthausen, and Ravensbrück, Belzec, Majdanek, Sobibor, Treblinka, and Auschwitz-Birkenau.

[TJMAC77SP]

Talking to the black ether.

OP long gone