Re-entry into Navy not going so well for friend..

[whacko]

I have a good friend, brothers he and I are, that wishes to re-enter into the Navy. He visited me roughly 3 months ago now and we were discussing the possibility of him re-entering into the Navy after being out for 10 years. His reasons, for those interested, is of course, promotion possibilities, job security (he has been with the same employer for the past 8 years though - he is a very stable individual with his act together) and he does miss the Navy to put it bluntly. He served his four years with Honorable service, so much so that the once CDR that he worked for (as his yeoman), now GS-15 (retired Capt.) gave him a very nice letter of recommendation and is trying to assist my friend in this re-entry process as it would seem almost as though the recruiter is not very interested in working on it.

Some details. When he was visiting, we went to the local recruiters office. We found he would have to wait until Oct. 1st for the new FY. No problem and completely understandable. This was in the middle of Sept. He returned home (from his visit at my place) a week before Oct 1st. Upon returning, the very next Monday he gave his local recruiters office a call for nothing else but to give notification of his intent and desire (ie. to give a heads up more-less) to a "NC1" (though shows up on the Global Address List as "BM2" -- perhaps only frocked still? who knows, regardless).

He obtained the paperwork listing what he would have to do, a consent for request of DD214, etc, etc. Actual sit down and work began Oct. 1st, the beginning of the new FY. It's now Nov. 20th and he is no further into the process than what he was when he first sat down with this "NC1". I'm not one to stereotype and speak badly about recruiters, that is generalization/stereotyping and is not my style. Though this recruiter appears to be sitting on his paperwork and we're unsure as to why. Within the 10 years that my friend has been a civilian, he did not do drugs, get any felonies or misdemeanors for that matter, show unstable employment... none of the above. He is not a "sh*tbird" as such type were referred to when I was in the Navy. So, we're baffled. Is there some sort of incentive for a recruiter to get a fresh body in, not knowing how they will perform in boot camp, A school (if -even- applicable for the new body) or the fleet for that matter, that the recruiter does not get re-entering a known "four O" sailor (he is very easily EP material, once he brushes up on his raiting and makes himself aware of the changes that took place while he was out of course)?

I'm perplexed and perhaps even upset. I cannot get back in, I have a re-entry code of RE-R4 (medical) so perhaps I'm living my re-entry through him, either way, he is a brother to me as many of you may have "brothers in arms" that you served alongside of and know precisely where I'm coming from in my feelings and desires to assist him.

For instance, he (my friend) signed a consent form for DD 214 retrieval. He signed and handed in this consent form to the recruiter back in October, albeit, the recruiter is claiming "I still haven't received a copy of your 214." Really? It takes that long? So, frustrated and as a last result type of deal, my friend contacted his GS-15 prior boss with his take on the situation. Said GS-15 contacted the CO of the recruiters office region (or however it is broken down), where the CO simply said something along the lines of "We will do everything we can to get this fine american into the Navy." I suppose the chief of the "NC1" was contacted, because of the "NC1" called my friend, claiming this and that reason (lots going on in life, etc.) for basically sitting on his re-entry package. Well, this was 3 weeks ago today that this "NC1" called and gave his excuses, stating also that he was still waiting for the DD214, etc, etc.

See, when I was in the Navy, this "NC1" would have been written up for dereliction of duty, though I suppose its a "new Navy" now. My friend should receive his DD214 within just a few days, as he has contacted NARA personally and the told him "within 2-3 working days after the signed consent is received." He's going to wait until he actually has the DD214 in hand before riding the recruiters butt about it.

Bottom line. A top performer veteran of the Navy, wishes to get back in... he was relatively young, only 22 years old when he had gotten out, much of the decision was because his wife (from his hometown) really wanted to go back to their "hometown", she a year younger than he. He's now 32, has two children and for conversations sake "matured" and knows precisely what he wants. He -wants- back into the Navy. He will pass the PRT with flying colors, will very likely score excellents (or better if there is such a thing) with all parts (i.e. the run, sit ups and push ups). He has his head on straight and has always had superior work ethics. Has a great personality. He truly deserves better than how he is being treated... not to say he is a king, but he isn't a "sh*tbird" either, which I have to say, is being treated as such.

I'm almost positive he could have visited the Army/Marine recruiter and he would have probably been done with boot camp already (I'm assuming after 10 years out and due to being a different branch he would have had to do boot camp - unsure and irrelevant as he wants back into the Navy). So, anyone, recruiter or not, know just WHY it would seem he is having so much conflict?

Some anonymous (unless of course you wish to advertise who you are - your prerogative) insight would be greatly appreciated!

[ringjamesa]

Ok, my 2 cents and keep in mind it is coming from a recruiter's perspective here.. Why doesn't he have a copy of his 214? Yeah the recruiter can try to track one down from Millington TX or St Louis but my first question would be-where is your copy? While you are getting on the recruiter, it is the applicant's responsibility to provide documentation requested. It does take time. The Recruiter may have to submit the SF 180 to several different locations and may come back with nothing. He might have tried New Orleans first..then Milligton...then St Louis....Then the VA. You can't expect the recruiter to make an applicant that doesn't have all of his documents a priority over one that does. You asked if there was a bonus or something for putting in NPS applicants over a PS. Not exactly but I can tell you that the AF and it sounds like the Navy only get so many PS slots per FY. Why would you put more effort into a PS applicant than a NPS applicant when you are limited to how many PS applicants you can put in and where you can put them? It isn't derilicition of duty it is doing you duty how you have been instructed to do it. I would reccomend that your friend get his documentation together and then re-engage. He can request a copy from TN, MO, or from the VA. Just ensure that he gets an UNDELETED copy. The VA copy won't work and member copy 1 will not work. The VA copy will not have item 25, 26, or 27 and member copy one will not have the Special Additional Information section at all.

[whacko]

Ok, my 2 cents and keep in mind it is coming from a recruiter's perspective here.. Why doesn't he have a copy of his 214?


He has a copy of his DD Form 214, however, it is a copy of a "part"/carbon copy. He was not given his two parts (short / long) upon discharge, due to a lazy PN (now PS). I didn't say ALL PN/PS's are lazy (lol directed to those PN/PS's out there). It's barely legible.. legible, but barely.

Yeah the recruiter can try to track one down from Millington TX or St Louis but my first question would be-where is your copy?

Mine is in my safe deposit box. I'm seriously asking these questions for a friend I served with, not myself. :)


While you are getting on the recruiter, it is the applicant's responsibility to provide documentation requested. It does take time. The Recruiter may have to submit the SF 180 to several different locations and may come back with nothing. He might have tried New Orleans first..then Milligton...then St Louis....Then the VA. You can't expect the recruiter to make an applicant that doesn't have all of his documents a priority over one that does.

I don't think he or I are setting great expectations. Though this recruiter claimed different "excuses" for not returning phone calls (i.e. family issues, this that or the other thing) all the while was on the local radio station doing a recruiting bit. I mean, I was attempting to keep my post as unbiased as possible as to not offend anyone. Don't take this as an attack on all recruiters, after all, it is a recruiters perspective I was hoping to hear from. :)

Said recruiter offered to obtain a copy of the DD Form 214. My friend has a job since his 10 years out, one in which he held for 8 years. So, he wasn't too concerned how legible or not his photocopy was. :) If my friend was to be responsible for obtaining a copy, I assure you he is responsible enough to have completed the task or seeing to it that it was completed - not to mention would have given a weekly update on the status of completion, unlike this recruiter unfortunately. Truth be told.


You asked if there was a bonus or something for putting in NPS applicants over a PS. Not exactly but I can tell you that the AF and it sounds like the Navy only get so many PS slots per FY. Why would you put more effort into a PS applicant than a NPS applicant when you are limited to how many PS applicants you can put in and where you can put them?


I suppose this depends on whether or not retention is a recruiters concern? Assuming it should be their concern, then that should be the primordial reason of recruiting duty. If it's not their concern, because they are not instructed it should be a concern, then I suppose for nothing else, but, to know that out in my fleet, I would have a certain "four O sailor" vice an unknown. Depends on one's pride I suppose. I am not aware of the Navy being limited of where they can "put" a PS applicant, unless you mean that from a Technical/job stand point in that you can, aherm, influence a NPS applicant as to which tech school (A school for us Navy folk) they'll attend. Also, I used the word incentive, not bonus, though that question appears to be still unanswered. ;)

I cannot see applying much effort into a NPS with a criminal record, when there is a ship shape PS looking to re-enter. Then again, I never worked recruiting duty, nor would I want to I believe.


It isn't derilicition of duty it is doing you duty how you have been instructed to do it. I would reccomend that your friend get his documentation together and then re-engage. He can request a copy from TN, MO, or from the VA. Just ensure that he gets an UNDELETED copy. The VA copy won't work and member copy 1 will not work. The VA copy will not have item 25, 26, or 27 and member copy one will not have the Special Additional Information section at all.


Right, he is now sending in a signed consent for an undeleted copy from NARA and will hopefully receive it soon. Though the fact remains, the recruiter offered, obtained signed consent for this more than a month ago now - that is where I believe he is derelict. His "barely legible" photocopy includes the reason for seperation, reentry code, etc. It's clearly legible enough to use the data, though as I told my friend, "You probably need a clearly legible copy for 'official' purposes."

[ringjamesa]

A photocopy doesn't do it though. Has to be original or certified copy. I agree with you wholeheartedly about taking PS over NPS. I would rather have someone who was in, got out for a few years, needs a couple months of OJT to get up to speed over someone who has to go to Basic and technical training before they can even start their OJT. However, that is not the reality in Recruiting right now. I feel you pain but AD AF and Navy are limiting the #s for PS and it makes what should be a simple process a very competetive one.

[whacko]

Ok. Well he is on track on getting a certified copy of his DD Form 214. Perhaps you could help him and I further, if you have another moment please.

What will he need precisely. In other words, what should his "re-entry package" (or whatever it is referred to as) consist of, besides his DD214? I completely understand the AF may differ from the Navy recruiting requirements, though, what does he have to do.. because for whatever reason, this NC1 is dealing with things step by step, though still only on step 1. As though he want's to be in charge and "the boss" of the entire thing. I'm helping out, because my wife is stationed in Norfolk and I imagine he'll get stationed in Norfolk as well, or hopefully. By helping him, I'm helping him for him and for me as well, as we'll be closer to hang out and such. Thus the reason why I am putting forth so much effort into this. He does not have Internet except when at work (he lives in the boonies were only "satellite" is available to him at a premium).

He was told though that due to the length of time he was out, the recruiter would need a statement/description stating that what he was doing as a civilian was similar work to what he was doing in the Navy. His recruiter has that. He said a waiver would need to be done for his 3 total dependents. Etc, etc. However, his recruiter stated something along the lines of, "I have to have this before I can do that." The DD214 being one of those things he "needs before I can do anything else." I just find this a bit hard to believe. Is this true? It's surprising to me there is not a single system similar to the MMPA, locator, that cannot be accessed to get some type of proverbial ball rolling. :/

[ringjamesa]

It is true that he needs the 214 before he can do anything else. The 214 is the basic eligibility document for PS applicant. The reason he wants details about the civilian work is that his rate is expired and instead of making him go to school again, I believe the recruiter is trying to establish that they can waive that requirement. Once they locate the 214, then he can send him to MEPS for they physical. NPC in Millington TN is 866 827 5672. If they can't find it, he should contact the local VA guy. the VA has an office at NPRC in St Louis that can try to find it. Just make sure he tells them he needs an undeleted copy. What was his rank when he got out? At least for the AF, rank matters with dependancy issues-E-4 and above...no problem

[1navynuke]

The biggest issue is that his recruiter is probably an active duty recruiter, and prior service recruits do not count toward their quota, so they usually get shoved to the back of the line. Prior service actually counts for reserve recruiters, but then you are in the reserves.

[ringjamesa]

The navy changed their recruiting about 4 years ago and now the AD and Reserve Recruiters are together-they all do both.

[1navynuke]

Yes, but prior service do not count until they ship. In other words you can put them back in the navy in Dec. but if they don't ship until July they don't count toward the monthly quota.