Senior chief to retire in hazing investigation

[SailorDave]

Originally Posted by gator_sailor

Guys like this don't desereve retirement quietly. He deserves some time in the brig as well. The officer-in-charge deserves some kind of discipline as well. Kick him out with a Big Chicken Dinner as an E1.

There really was no OIC. The E7 (note I do not refer to him as a Chief) reported to an O6 who, I might add, has some significant culpability in this, too. He failed to adequately supervise the unit, instead completely allowing the E7 to do everything. That's too much power for any one person to have.

[Yggdrasil]

I'll be 100% honest here: if this guy gets to retire in his current pay grade, I won't be upset. In fact, I hope he does. Why? How many officers have committee FAR worse attrocities (for example, selling drugs, child molestation, etc), and have been told to retire EARLY, without any loss in rank; where he an enlisted person did the SAME thing, he'd be busted to E1, dishonorably discharged, and sent to prison?

At least this guy here has to finish out his 20 before he can retire. Until we see some equality in how enlisted and officers get punished, you won't see of pining for any further punishment than what it looks like he's gonna get.

[jeffersj]

Originally Posted by Yggdrasil

I'll be 100% honest here: if this guy gets to retire in his current pay grade, I won't be upset. In fact, I hope he does. Why? How many officers have committee FAR worse attrocities (for example, selling drugs, child molestation, etc), and have been told to retire EARLY, without any loss in rank; where he an enlisted person did the SAME thing, he'd be busted to E1, dishonorably discharged, and sent to prison?

At least this guy here has to finish out his 20 before he can retire. Until we see some equality in how enlisted and officers get punished, you won't see of pining for any further punishment than what it looks like he's gonna get.

Gonna ask an honest question here.

Where is the information coming from that the miscreant doesn't have his twenty years in yet? Closest thing I have seen is the article where it lists his chronological age as 38. Depending on when he came in, it is entirely possible that he already has twenty years in and is simply waiting for the paperwork to be processed.

Yes, there are folks that did worse, and in some cases managed to get away without losing any rank/rate. Then there are others that had retired, were nailed for lesser offenses (such as adultery) that occurred during the course of their military duties, were brought back and then retired at a lower grade.

[Measure Man]

Originally Posted by jeffersj

Gonna ask an honest question here.

Where is the information coming from that the miscreant doesn't have his twenty years in yet? Closest thing I have seen is the article where it lists his chronological age as 38. Depending on when he came in, it is entirely possible that he already has twenty years in and is simply waiting for the paperwork to be processed.

It came from the article:

Toussaint enlisted in the Navy on Jan. 23, 1990, Navy records show, so allowing him to remain on active duty until January will ensure that he receives retirement benefits.

[JGStewart]

This is part of the problem. If this had of been a civilian, he would have spent along time in jail. By allowing this senior chief to retire instead of court martialing him, the Navy is sending the message that you will get a slap on the wrist if you are a chief or higher. Where as the lower enlisted from earlier incidents were kicked out. I'm tired of seeing junior enlisted getting hammered where senior enlisted and officers get off for doing the same exact thing. Senior enlisted and officers are supposed to set the example and are not supposed to be above the law. I realize that it's not all senior enlisted and officers, but when it happens often enough that it seems comon place then someting needs to be done about it. This problem is not just in the Navy, but all services. I saw some during my 4 years in the Marines and have seen lots in my 9 years in the Navy. I realize rank has it's privaleges, but that doesn't mean you don't have to follow the rules just like everybody else and nobody is above the law.

[Yggdrasil]

Originally Posted by JGStewart

This is part of the problem. If this had of been a civilian, he would have spent along time in jail. By allowing this senior chief to retire instead of court martialing him, the Navy is sending the message that you will get a slap on the wrist if you are a chief or higher. Where as the lower enlisted from earlier incidents were kicked out. I'm tired of seeing junior enlisted getting hammered where senior enlisted and officers get off for doing the same exact thing. Senior enlisted and officers are supposed to set the example and are not supposed to be above the law. I realize that it's not all senior enlisted and officers, but when it happens often enough that it seems comon place then someting needs to be done about it. This problem is not just in the Navy, but all services. I saw some during my 4 years in the Marines and have seen lots in my 9 years in the Navy. I realize rank has it's privaleges, but that doesn't mean you don't have to follow the rules just like everybody else and nobody is above the law.

From what I've seen, the line isn't drawn between blueshirt and khaki; it's drawn between enlisted and officer. Remember the CMDCM that was soliciting minors for sex, and was busted to E1 and kicked out? That would NEVER happen to an officer who does the SAME THING.

[Yggdrasil]

Originally Posted by jeffersj

Gonna ask an honest question here.

Where is the information coming from that the miscreant doesn't have his twenty years in yet? Closest thing I have seen is the article where it lists his chronological age as 38. Depending on when he came in, it is entirely possible that he already has twenty years in and is simply waiting for the paperwork to be processed.

Measure Man just quoted it for you, but I did want to add something else: this is actually the first time I had ever seen an E7 or above get caught doing something this serious BEFORE they were retirement eligible. Normally, it's always after their 20-year mark that they do something stupid; where if they would have just retired at 20, they'd be in the clear.

One of the reasons why I don't want to do a day over 20 - it's always after the 20 year mark that someone gets possessed by some weird demon, and does something stupid to piss away their retirement.

[jeffersj]

Originally Posted by Yggdrasil

Measure Man just quoted it for you, but I did want to add something else: this is actually the first time I had ever seen an E7 or above get caught doing something this serious BEFORE they were retirement eligible. Normally, it's always after their 20-year mark that they do something stupid; where if they would have just retired at 20, they'd be in the clear.

One of the reasons why I don't want to do a day over 20 - it's always after the 20 year mark that someone gets possessed by some weird demon, and does something stupid to piss away their retirement.

Thanks.

I never saw the article Measure Man quoted, but no matter. That's why you ask questions.

There have been other cases where an E-7 or above did something stupid and threw away pretty much everything before they were eligible for retirement. Not all of them made the press. Been some where they were retirement eligible and the retirement got taken away as they were thrown out. It happens.

[ElectricElvis]

I'm voting for the big-rocks to little-rocks punishment. Toushit should be busted to E-1 and sent to Leavenworth.

Along with that, Big Navy needs to stiffen it's upper lip when dealing with these kinds of infractions from senior personnel, enlisted OR officer. They should ALL be busted all the way down their respective paygrade, and do time. How much time as determined by the severity of the actions. We have enlisted personnel up to the E6 level getting court martialed for doing this kind of thing to terrorists and being sent to Leavenworth; why is there less punishment when it's done to our own??

[Texpat]

Just some boys having a little fun ... you guys are wound up too tightly.