SecNav, CNO: Women should serve on subs

[rmmpe]

I never claimed to be an expert on crew integration.
Nor am I expert in driving big trucks.
But, I do know a Semi won't fit in a 2-car garage.

[SOBERSUBMRNR]

Originally Posted by forcedj

I know...or if you've only made cruises on a sub that you can be an expert on crew integration?

I've been underway on submarines without women on board, a submarine with women on board (several times) and a mixed-gender surface ship. BTDT. I've been around since 1983 and I remember when women went to surface ships. It has not worked there due to all the screwing around the fan rooms, women who deliberately get pregnant to get out of sea duty/deployment and the general lowering of discipline that came with all the male-female interaction. The senior men are often either afraid to discipline the women or don't want to adversely affect their shipboard sex life by making them angry. These problems exist and exist in spades. And the senior females don't seem to be much help in keeping the junior females in line. Soooo....when those problems are truly resolved (and not swept under the mat as they are now), then come talk to me about placing females on submarines.

Yes, our mores are different. Males and females in say, Sweden, have no problem with getting naked in front of each other. That is exactly what happens on their vessels. That will never fly in the USN. There must be a separation of the sexes IRT berthing and sanitary facilities.

[rmmpe]

SOBERSUBMRNR ,

Your comment

"Soooo....when those problems are truly resolved (and not swept under the mat as they are now), then come talk to me about placing females on submarines"

pretty much ends this thread (except for the drivel that is sure to follow from the ignorant).

It'll be a very long time, if ever, before what is currently a failed experiment can be proven workable.

Bob Mahon (SS)

[tmurphy]

I am up for orders in JAN...see you on the boat....just glad to be back in the FLEET! Go Navy, Beat Army!

[SWOFish]

So none of you have ever served somewhere that integration has worked? Just curious.

Not trolling, promise...ok maybe a little!

[rmmpe]

Why are you focusing on "somewhere that integration has worked"?
This is not about "somewhere". It's about Subs.

[SWOFish]

Mr. Mahan(SS),

A ship is just a ship. I have served on surface ships that are considerably more cramped than a SSBN/SSGN.

[SWOFish]

Correction, and apologies, Mr Mahon, for misspelling your name.

[rmmpe]

There is certainly no need to apologize for spelling my name incorrectly.
However, comparing duty on any surface ship, regardless of size, where you can see the light of day or the luminescence of plankton at midnight, to duty on a Sub is no comparison.

[SWOFish]

How does the view out the window have anything to do with crew living space, privacy, interaction between males and females, or the price of tea in China?